Hi10P Info / Guide

  By nand | July 23, 2011 - 9:42 am | , , , , , ,

“What is Hi10P?” — An infoguide (v3.9.0)

You don’t need to follow this guide anymore, just install KCP. Click the above picture to be redirected.

 

 

NOTICE: Before you continue, please take note the author of this guide has stopped updating it. He is no longer using windows and is using mplayer2 as his player now. If you want him to continue to update this guide please leave a comment below stating why he should. Try to convince him! – 06/02/2012

Basically, Hi10P is just an H.264 profile which uses 10 bits of information to represent color — doing this for some reason means we can get less banding (if you don’t know what that is, just know that it’s a Bad Thing) and a smaller file size. I won’t go into any further detail here but it’s basically a huge improvement. This guide is intended to help people find ideal media player solutions to play back Hi10P content — and Anime in general — and will be updated constantly as new information gets released or existing products change.

How to play back Hi10P content:

There are a number of different methods available to achieve (smooth) Hi10P playback:

  • Download the SMplayer standalone, or just use mplayer2 from the CLI
  • Grab the latest CCCP and use the player that comes with it (CCCP will dither everything down to 8 bit before rendering. You might also run into performance issues on slower hardware)
  • Use MPC-HC together with madVR and LAV (jump to guide) (maximum quality but needs a bit of configuration + tweaking)
  • Download the latest unstable build of VLC Media Player (you really shouldn’t be using VLC) and install it
  • If you’re having trouble playing Hi10P due to performance reasons, CoreAVC 3 is now out, but it still has some issues. Oh, and apparently worse performance than ffdshow. Never mind this, don’t install CoreAVC except for 8-bit software decoding (oh, LAV Video has faster CUDA decoding as well for 8-bit)

Pick one!

Mplayer2 (and SMplayer by extension) will be fine for most users, especially those who want something that just works out of the box. For the maximum playback quality however, you’ll need to use MPC-HC + madVR as shown below.

If you use some other operating system like GNU/Hurd/Linux/Haiku/BSD/VMX/OS/2/MS-DOS/Menuet/BareMetalOS/whatever, it’s the same deal — just get mplayer2 or VLC.

On Mac OS X, get Mplayer OSX with these binaries if you want OC and other neat stuff.

How NOT to play back Hi10P content:

  • CoreAVC in CUDA mode, DXVA, LAV CUVID as well as the stable versions of VLC and ffdshow do not support Hi10P at the time of writing, because no graphics cards support 10-bit decoding
  • The SVN build of ffdshow-tryouts now supports Hi10P
  • Note: Using VSFilter (aka DirectVobSub) with Hi10P requires dithering material down to 8-bit first, which can introduce some quantization inaccuracies later on and also uses incorrect levels due to a bug in swscale (when using CCCP/ffdshow or LAV to dither)

Pros of Hi10P:

  • Significantly higher compression ratios resulting in vastly decreased file sizes. The first rounds of testing show a 20-40% improvement on file sizes
  • Far more information is preserved from the original, removing such issues as banding and poor detail in dark scenes
  • The encoder will have less things to worry about

Cons:

  • Slower decoding and encoding
  • No support for DXVA or CUDA as of writing
  • Slight compatibility issues when using obscure, obsolete devices like the PS3 to play back movies — but who does that, really?

Motivation behind switching:

All technology is designed to move into the future. It was the same way with DVDs, the same way with Blu-ray discs, the same way with DivX and it’s the same with Hi10P. Newer decoders are much faster even with Hi10P content than decoders were in 8-bit mode a year ago, so that alone gives us the power needed to back it.

How to encode in Hi10P:

Assuming you already know how to encode, grab the relevant “10bit depth” build of x264. On Linux, just run “./configure –bit-depth=10” before compiling.

Special notice: The official x264 builds are still bugged and convert the levels incorrectly. If you want an unofficial build of x264 with the the fixes, use JEEB’s builds or patch it yourself.

If you use CRF, increase it slightly. If you use a bit rate, you can lower it a bit. Groups are still working hard to find the best settings, so only time will tell how much to raise/lower CRF by.

Make sure you either tag your releases with “Hi10P” or mention it somewhere in the description. Feel free to link back to this guide in the post/readme, to help people set up a working media player before they go whine in your comments section.

Examples of Hi10P content:

Hi10P anime samples can be found click here or here.

A good series of comparison images between 8 bit and 10 bit compression can be found here. These prove that 10-bit content produces much less aliasing at the same bitrate

There are plenty of picture comparisons available too. Remember to keep in mind that it isn’t 100% perfect yet and encoders are working hard to get the right settings.

Misconceptions about Hi10P and 10-bit output:

Having a 10-bit (aka 30-bit / DeepColor) display is NOT needed to see the benefits of Hi10P – 10-bit content, even when dithered down to 8 bit, is still significantly higher quality than 8 bit content, and the file sizes speak for themselves.

However, should you be one of the 0.01% of people with a 10-bit (or higher) display, you’ll need something like an AMD FirePro card, because even though the hardware is literally exactly the same, you can not for some reason just use the FirePro drivers and enable 10-bit output. It’s quite impossible, I’m sure of it. You’ll also need to use EVR CP because madVR doesn’t support 10 bit output yet for whatever reason I can’t fathom, but if you can patch your FirePro drivers I assume you can set up EVR CP as well.

Setup guide for MPC-HC + madVR:

This method will result in higher image quality and performance than using CCCP (or anything ffdshow-based, really), so if you’re struggling to play back Hi10P anime, or even regular 1080p, consider trying this. MadVR and LAV are updated regularly and uses very new versions of libav for decoding as well as custom edits to make 10-bit decoding even faster, giving it much more speed than the ridiculously outdated ffdshow-tryouts project, and the even more ridiculously outdated CCCP codec pack that is based on it.

Step Zero: Prerequisites:

  1. Uninstall ALL instances of MPC-HC, CCCP, ffdshow, madVR, Haali, K-lite, CoreAVC etc. you might have on your system.
    This is a clean guide that requires no other prerequisites to function, and ideally should have none installed either.

Step One: Downloading and Installation:

  1. Download and install the latest version of MPC-HC (you want the .exe version for an installer)
    Note: Get the 32-bit version (called x86) ONLY! The 64-bit version is incompatible with madVR and will not function at all
  2. Install the LAV Filters. These are necessary for decoding video and audio. You need to select the Splitter as well if you don’t want to use Haali, otherwise you have to install Haali manually:
  3. Obtain and install the latest version of Haali’s Media Splitter
  4. Note: You can skip this step if your PC isn’t very powerful! Download the latest version of madVR and extract it anywhere you like. Run install.bat inside the folder. DO NOT DELETE THE FOLDER AFTERWARDS, madVR lives inside it and does not copy itself anywhere else. Move it somewhere sensible before installing, for example C:\Program Files\madVR.
    Note: Make sure you’re logged in as an Administrator when running this! Do not right click and “run as admin”, log in as admin and run it normally!

Step Two: Configuration:

  1. Open up MPC-HC’s options menu. Under “Internal Filters”, disable everything. You can leave some of the ones on the left active, but make sure you’ve disabled all of the ones not selected here:
  2. Under Playback, enable “Auto-load subtitles”:
  3. Under Subtitles, make sure “Allow animation when buffering” is enabled, and “Maximum texture resolution” is set to “Desktop”:
  4. Under Output, choose “madVR” as renderer: Note: If you skipped madVR, or you’re experiencing lagging, frame drops or poor performance in general, set this to “EVR Custom Pres.”, “Haali Renderer” or “VMR-9 (renderless)” instead – try them in that order until you find one that works.
  5. Make sure the LAV Video is selected as default decoder. If in doubt, go to external filters, choose “Add Filter”, select LAV Video Decoder and switch it to “Prefer”:
  6. After making the above changes, restart MPC-HC and play back any file. You should notice the madVR icon in the system tray. Right click this to access the settings:

    Once inside, disable the “fullscreen exclusive mode” under Rendering -> General Settings. I recommend leaving this off unless you are having playback problems, because it prevents you from taking screenshots and makes the transition to fullscreen very ugly (It also messes up MPC-HC’s interface):

Step Three: Confirmation:

  1. Play back a Hi10P file and use Ctrl+J to enter the OSD: (If it doesn’t show up or looks completely different, doublecheck output configuration)

    Correct

    Incorrect
  2. Finally, check the “Filters” list (in the right click menu of MPC-HC during playback) and confirm that LAV Video is being used:

Troubleshooting:

  • If you don’t see subtitles after adding madVR as prefer, update your version of MPC-HC to at least build 3520 (which is still beta)! Alternatively, don’t add it as prefer and remove / de-prioritize the conflicting filters instead (example with ffdshow is shown above)
  • If you still don’t see it, double check to see that you have the 32-bit version of MPC-HC and not the 64-bit version
  • Creating Direct3D device failed (8876086c): Go to your output configuration and change the video renderer from madVR to something like EVR Custom Pres
  • Slow performance, frame drops, lagging: See the line above
  • If you’re having trouble taking screenshots, keep in mind that the best way to take screenshots from madVR is pressing PrintScreen on your keyboard, then pasting it to an external editing program like mspaint
  • Should you have any remaining problems, don’t hesitate to contact the author over IRC: #coalgirls on irc.rizon.net

 

(Bonus/Optional) Adding ffdshow:

Adding ffdshow will allow you to use its audio decoder (for filters + a more customizable mixer), as well as using it for formats other than AVC1 (H.264), VC1 and MPEG-2. Especially for older 480p and worse content (which isn’t likely to be encoded in AVC1), you can use the ffdshow deblocking or debanding filters to attempt to improve image quality this way.

  1. Install the latest ffdshow-tryouts
  2. Open ffdshow’s settings dialog, under “DirectShow control” set the merit to normal: (To get here, just go to Start -> All Programs -> ffdshow -> Video decoder configuration)
  3. Double check Step Three to make sure ffdshow doesn’t touch your H.264 video

Enjoy Anime!

Feedback and disclaimer:

If something is terribly wrong here or needs to be updated (even if it’s just a typo), leave a comment below and I’ll do my best to get back to you. You can also contact the author directly.

All content here is provided as-is with no actuary or implied warranties or guarantees of bodily, mental or otherworldly safety. If you don’t like the fact that every sentence is full of links, blame MediaWiki.

Guide originally inspired by Ryuumaru. All content based on nand’s original research and Google. All text and images are in public domain, except for the background video content on the OSD screenshots, which belongs to the owner of Bakemonogatari.

No credit needs to be given when copying any content in this post in whole or in part, but a link back would still be beneficial since this post is guaranteed to be updated constantly and reflects the latest developments in decoding / media playback. If you want to link back, you can use the provided button:

<a href=”http://haruhichan.com/wpblog/?p=205″><img style=”border-width: 0px; background-color: transparent;” src=”http://haruhichan.com/img/Guides/Hi10P.png” alt=”Hi10P Info / Guide” width=”150″ height=”83″ /></a>

Hi10P Info / Guide

 <a href=”http://haruhichan.com/wpblog/?p=205″><img style=”border-width: 0px; background-color: transparent;” src=”http://haruhichan.com/img/Guides/Hi10P2.png” alt=”Hi10P Info / Guide” width=”150″ height=”83″ /></a>

Hi10P Info / Guide

About nand

Just some German guy.
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  • http://twitter.com/FLYhex FLY

    For anyone interested, if you have MPC already installed SKIP MOST STEPS, you ONLY need to:
    1. install LAV Video Filter
    2. in MPC’s External Filters options menu add it
    3. mark it “Prefer”
    That’s it, no clean installs or anything else.

  • Anon

    hi. i’m new to this..

    anyway is this guide updated or outdated?

    • http://www.haruhichan.com/ Swaps4

      Hey, yes it is quite outdated. As stated at the top of this very post, I suggest you use http://www.haruhichan.com/KCP/ over this guide.

  • oasis789

    thanks, this worked perfectly!

  • Anonymous

    nand, could you write a guide for mplayer2 or video playing in general on GNU/Linux?

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  • @5oY

    thank you for sharing the mplayer 2, it realy supprise me to see my 10bit anime collection in diffrent view!!!
    amazing

  • asd

    You don’t need to change your subtitle resolution anymore they made it default to desktop in new MPC versions

  • nobody

    Followed this to finally ditch the ancient CCCP, and everything’s working great, except for my copies of [LRE]‘s Urusei Yatsura that for some reason play fine via smplayer2 but drop every other frame or so with this setup. Weird. But thanks for the guide.

  • worriedsome

    Hi,
    I tried following the guide here but I didn’t use MadVR (asus X401U specs AMD Brazos dual core C60 1GHz couldn’t handle it). The video plays fine in MPC-HC except sometimes the sounds would dissappear and re-appear again . Is there anyway to fix the audio output without messing the video & subtitles output?

    I have tried any guides available out there but only to have the video and the subtitles not in sync. The subtitles appears faster than the audio.

  • Rin

    compression difference between 8p and 10p is very minimum in margin, probably, 2-3 megs.

    Funny thing that, they uses 10p encoding on 8p sources, lol. The 10p was made for 10p color space, that latest digital recording cameras supported. Which is 10p will be benefit if the recorded video is based on real environment, not in anime since they dont really use many complicated colors.

    But in anime, either FreeTV broadcast/DVD/Blu-Ray, all of them are uses 8p color space. So why the heck are these fansub bastards just jump with 10p encoding when their sources are obviously are 8p sources.

  • Anna

    There’s just one thing that I don’t get. It’s shown above that both LAV audio and ffdshow audio processor are on, but if I leave LAV audio on “set merit” the only only showing up is ffdshow audio whereas if I set it on “prefer” then the only one showing up is LAV audio. How should it be set?

  • Mike

    Hey man , it worked perfect for MPC , thanks a lot .

  • http://techlorebyigor.blogspot.com Amethyst Igor

    Thanks, this excellent guide helped me play local 720p video files at long last on my Windows XP system which uses a new 1.6 mhz ASUS E35M1-M motherboard with an AMD Fusion E-350 APU which has a combined cpu/gpu on die. This motherboard is optimal for HTPC setup, because it does not require any cpu fan (passive cooling) and consumes a measly 18 Watts of electricity.

    One thing I would add to your instructions–for my specific setup of Windows XP–is that I chose VMR-9 renderless rather than anything else; only installed LAV video and audio as per your instructions (not MadVR or any splitter), installed the latest version of MPC-HC and made almost all the modifications you suggested (note, VMR-9 renderless was my choice due to using Windows XP) and I went into LAV Video config and although I’m not sure it makes a big difference, I made sure to select Hardware Acceleration, specifically DXVA-2. Other than that, I made the changes you suggested to Internal and External filters. Now it seems that I can play local 720p files without problems! Thanks.

  • Null

    Thanks for the huge work you put into this guide.. I was getting fed up with not being able to play 10-bit videos before.. I tried to ignore the problem until I came into an anime that wasn’t translated in 1280×270 except in 10-bit.. so I had to find a solution which happened to be your guide.. mad props.

    I have only one problem that I came into after following the MPC steps (I skipped madVR btw)..
    Double clicking files doesn’t start them on MPC-HC or any other player (never installed any other player and may never do) and when I click “open with” I can’t find MPC there.
    I went into proprieties of a file and browsed for MPC.exe and solved the double clicking problem..
    but some/a lot of the files that didn’t show thumbnail got the MPC logo on the blank paper icon like this:
    http://imgur.com/c7oKs

    I think it’s probably not related to your guide (not originated from it) but any idea how to solve this?

    • Null

      Almost forgot..
      My pc’s system type is 64-bit if that can help.

      • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

        Right click any .mkv file, Open with > Choose default program > Other programs > Media Player Classic – Home Cinema. If it isn’t there just click ‘browse’ and navigate to the MPC-HC.exe

        • Null

          Ah that’s what I did already which made the files work :)
          I was just wondering if there was a way to make all/most of the thumbnails appear.. because a lot aren’t showing now (since before.. they used to either show thumbnail or at least MPC icon.. not MPC icon on blank paper like in the pic I included).
          If there’s no way it’s ok and thank you.. I’m just being a little childish and picky so it’s no problem :P

          • Drewishman

            I know this is a couple months late and you may not need an answer any more, but there is a file association option in MPC. Go to Options>Player>Formats and check which formats you want to open with it by default, it should then refresh all of the icons on your screen. The ones you checked should have the correct icon.

  • Irwan

    Thanks, you really help me with my netbook.

  • WhiteLotus

    is the MPC + MadVR settings will affect 8-bit anime ?

    • WhiteLotus

      sorry for triple post…

  • http://www.computechy.co.cc noname

    what is the difference (especially on playback quality) than using latest k-lite mega codec ?
    so many steps and looks not simple @_@
    can you tell me the advantages by doing all of this ?

  • Ac

    Ty for guide.
    well I have small problem. All anime i try 10bit or 8bit example
    [SubDESU]_Asa_Made_Jugyo_Chu!_(BD_1920x1080_x264_10bit_FLAC)_[4318EA1B], working well no problem at all except [Yousei-raws] Final Fantasy VII Advent Children Complete [BDrip 1920x1080 x264 TrueHD].
    Just FF7 get laggy and no sound. i follow all u guide except adding ffdshow.
    Please help me and if ffdshow can resolve my problem, plz add guide for install ffdshow(what option that i must tick or untick so ffdshow not hv problem with other filter) ty so much.

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  • Exo

    Step Three: Confirmation:

    Play back a Hi10P file and use Ctrl+J to enter the OSD: (If it doesn’t show up or looks completely different, doublecheck output configuration)
    Correct

    Incorrect

    I have always the incorrect screen, but why?

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      You’ve messed up somewhere. Start again from the start and follow everything word for word.

  • clamo

    I just tried this 10bit encoding out by using ripbot264 and even tho there is not to many options with this setting I can say that encoding in 10bit’s vs 8bits does provide a better picture with lower file sizes. I normally encode to 8gb’s and I am running out of space on my HDD’s (1tb and a 2tb still isn’t enough) and based on a comparison of screens shots, the 10bit @ 4gb’s looks about the same as the 8bit @8gb’s. only con was the video was not playable in ALL media players. this is y no one has adapted to 10bit encoding.
    but for some one that can play them back this would be your best bet to save space, and to retain quality lvl’s. one program that’s widely used by a lot of people is power dvd and the file did not play in this player. however…..vlc, wmp, and Nvidia’s 3D player did play the clip back with no issues that I notably seen.

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  • rhapsodic

    ok, so I used this tutorial a few months ago it worked smoothly except for the one about the lav playing only with audio, a problem I easily solved by reading the comments (the comment said something about reinstalling lav which I did and it worked perfectly)
    Now, suddenly for some reason I can’t seem to watch properly. The show keeps on lagging or freezing and when I checked the filters, LAV video decoder is gone again! Sure, reinstalling may be a solution but I don’t want to keep on doing it over again since I’m expecting this would happen again next time after I reinstall lav. Is there another solution for this?

    • rhapsodic

      by lav playing only with audio, I mean to say that in the filters only LAV Audio decoder is shown without the LAV Video decoder which (according to the tutorial) should have also been there

      • Hito

        Did you make sure both LAV Video and Audio Decoder were set to prefer in the External Filters setting in MPC like step 5? Just check to make sure.

        • Anonymous

          Yes, I already did that

        • rhapsodic

          Yes, I did. And as expected, a filter disappeared again :/.
          This time around, the audio filter disappeared leaving me with a soundless video. Help :<

          • Hito

            The reason I suggested that was because something similar happen to me and when I checked the External Filters, one of them was missing, don’t know how that happened, but it hasn’t messed up so far after adding it back.

            I’m not sure, but just to be safe, I’d say uninstall everything, MPC, madVR, and LAV, and any other codec stuff you may have and restart your computer then follow the guide exactly. Make sure you get the newest versions for all of them.

            Newest LAV is 0.50.5
            http://files.1f0.de/lavf/LAVFilters-0.50.5.exe

  • Mark

    I can’t play back mkv’s using ordered chapters. Is this because madVR doesn’t support ordered chapters, or is it some other sort of problem? I’m using Lav splitter + audio and video filters.
    The ordered chapters do work in vlc.

    • Mark

      Nvm I fixed it. I had to use Haali splitter instead of LAV.

  • BigBadBorg

    After a new installation of windows just a few hours ago I remembered this guide, googled and found it. And once again my videos are running perfectly fine! Thank you very much once more!!! :)

  • Mtay

    Thank you Anonym I had the same problem as Pra7ul and it fixed it, good shit bro

    • http://j-list.com Raw D Coy

      jeeeezuuus christ that’s along guide i really don’t know why u should go through all that trouble to just be able to see a little movie/series, just download shark 007 and make some tweaks in the client as like audio setup and such take about 3 mins and u can play every single video file I’ve used it for 2 years and i haven’t come up on any problems in my film watching, I’ve been watching a lot of anime and movies always the best quality and i never stood up on any problems. easy peasy…

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  • Pra7ul

    When i put renderer to madVR >> only audio shows up with black screen,

    i tried installing again again according to instruction but no good.

    so now am using VMR9 (renderless)**

    so whats the problem here ???

    [ win7 + .net + dx11update and everything required ]

    • Anonym

      Turn off “use a separate device for presentation” in the “rendering -> general settings” options.

      • blankscreenproblem

        Did this and still no luck… please… could somebody help?

        • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

          Uninstall ALL instances of MPC-HC, CCCP, ffdshow, madVR, Haali, K-lite, CoreAVC etc. you might have on your system. Do this again and start from the very beginning of the guide.

  • zerker

    just wondering, which one to use Haali’s Media Splitter or LAV Splitter? if i want quality, which one would i go for?

    • tryco2

      lav

  • Mahru

    I have an iMac running Lion and VLC version 2.0.1 (?) by itself plays any 10 bit file with no problems at all.

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  • Auks

    Dude, how do you take screenshots where explorer windows and the shading is transparent? Are you a wizard?

  • Depraved

    Are much stronger colors and contrast a feature of MadVR or a bug? I noticed it says oversaturation is a problem, but I have it set up according to the guide. EVR and WMR9 look the same (a little washed out) but MadVR is like double the contrast and color.

    How can I tell?

    • nand

      Sounds like a bug.

  • lucz

    i can’t access folder that had 10 bit format video.. i can’t copy or move it. When i tried to access/move it, my computer lag and give an error message. Please help me

    • Someone

      When you ran install.bat, you registered it with Windows. That’s why you can’t move it and still have it play. Just uninstall it, move it to where you want it to go, and rerun install.bat.

    • Blasphemor

      If you have MKV thumbnail generation turned on, then disable it. I had that same problem with my 10bit videos and I had that feature on, somehow when i switched the icon view from large thumbnail to details or list, the folders with the videos stopped crashing, then switched again to large thumbnails and started crashing again, so I figured out it had to be the thumbnail generation what was causing the crashes so I disabled it… and no more crashes.

      hope it helped

  • Obvision

    i´ve had a problem with the audio, it is nothing big, just a pain in the neck….after starting the play back the audio is always on 4.0 mode, but i watch anime with headphones, so i want to know how to config it so that the player is in 2.0 mode

    sorry for bad english, not my motherlanguage ;)

  • Ferret

    I would love it if you continued updating this guide. Myself and so many others depend on you.

  • miracles

    Use MPC-HC together with madVR and LAV (jump to guide) (maximum quality but needs a bit of configuration + tweaking).

    I want to ask whether the guide from above using VSFilter or not and how can I find out?

  • Dog

    Kinda weird but on my lab top it runs amazing on the integrated graphics card but not on my dedicated graphic card (frame rate issues). Any ideas why.

    Integrated graphics: Intel (R) HD Graphics
    dedicated graphics memory 64 mb
    Shared 1632 mb

    Dedicated graphic card: Nvidia Ge-force GT 520m 1gb

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  • nitd

    I believe I followed all the steps in the guide, but when I do Step3: Confirmation, I only see LAV audio decoder

    • nitd

      nvm, solved it by uninstalling and reinstalling LAV

  • Animeswordmaster

    So, I downloaded ffdshow, and I followed the guide exactly. All of my Hi10 anime plays perfectly now (thanks a lot for the info!), but now, none of my old .avi or .mp4 files will play. Any advice? Could it be I didn’t select something during installation at this stage?
    http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l290/Anime_Jonny/installquestion.jpg

    • 1

      Same thing happen to me. Just downloaded all the latest files and getting this problem.

    • Iyo

      Update to the newest version of MPC-HC (March 1st Release or newer) and the problem is fixed.

  • Sean

    LAV Filter was updated to 0.48…I believe two days ago? This is a great and quick guide, it might help to link to the update.

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      I’ve updated it. Please take the time to read the notice at the very top of this guide.

  • AoiVIII

    i’ve followed this guide word for word and for some reason I can’t get MPC-HC to play Kyousougiga (or any other torrent for that matter). I’ve tried opening the torrent with MPC-HC and using the quick file start under MPC-HC and nothing happened. Also, when I click on filter when the video is playing; it’s using LAV Video decoder and madVR video renderer but the audio is MPC Audio decoder and MPC Flv source. I setup madVR, LAV audio, and LAV video decoder as preferred under external and the audio doesn’t work.

    (idk if this affects anything, but the torrents aren’t saved as media files, so i can;t select them)

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      • troll

        This photo appeared in my post on another website… are you from IDforums.net? I seem to be falling prey to this meme.

        • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

          Nope, never heard of that forum.

  • mpz

    MPC-HC v1.6.0.4014 released just last month (on 2012-01-30) supports 10-bit out of the box, no need to install any extra decoders. It even automatically uses DXVA (hardware decoding) for 8-bit files and software for 10-bit, so everything works without any special attention.

    VLC 2.0 released yesterday (2012-02-18) also supports 10-bit now.

  • 20sat92

    Hey guys and nand ofc, vlc 2.0 got released today and they said it has a much improved mkv demuxer and plays 10-bit encodes and other major improvements + added features and a simplified interface + better functionality with the mac. Idc about anything else but how good vlc 2.0 is at playing hi10p encodes so can some give out some settings to play the files correctly or does vlc 2.0 even play 10-bit files any good? Basically what i’m asking is if vlc 2.0 is better than mpc-hc now or on the same level or worse and why? Any probs with subs/ ordered chaps/encoding/decoding/etc

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      It doesn’t handle colors correctly yet – http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/108601

      • Anonymous

        Correct me if I’m wrong, but is the difference that the colors are a bit washed out? It’s really hard to tell the difference. Also, what about MPC-HC v1.6.0.4014? It has Hi10p playback out of the box, but does it work as well as mplayer2 or the madVR setup? Thank you.

        • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

          Yes, it is actually really easy to tell the difference. What kind of screen are you using? Also I haven’t got around to messing with MPC-HC v1.6.0.4014 yet, so I can’t comment on it at.

          • Anonymous

            I’m using a P-MVA 8-bit screen, glossy. My point was that when the show is moving it would be difficult to tell the difference. Even with the still image it’s hard to tell if you aren’t looking for a difference. But once you do notice, it looks like it’s almost black and white.

            Besides, if you didn’t have the “proper” setup, you would never be able to tell the colors were wrong.

  • absurdum

    Please come back nand, who cares about tp7.

  • Anonymous

    Come back nand, who cares about tp7.

  • regorthegreat

    My biggest reason for wanting Windows Media Player to handle the codec for Hi10 decoding is because I use Windows MCE for all of my video watching. If MPC-HC worked in MCE with the remote, I’d be perfectly fine with that…

    I’m considering switching to Hi10 for all new content, but if playback is this restricted, I might just have to hold off for a while.

    • Nand

      Won’t windows media player use any DirectShow codec it can find? Try installing LAV Filters and using that with WMP.

  • glens nicholas

    I’m watching Chibiki release of the Idolm@ster .. and at the second episode , the karaoke flashes on and off (I’ve no problem using VLC , but vlc doesn’t has shaders that makes everything instantly look good , so I prefer not to use that) . any workaround ? thanks

  • HanDuet

    Forgive me if this is the wrong place to ask for help with this problem; I set up my media playblack following this guide, and I’m not sure if something was done wrong to cause this.

    It appears that when a video’s subtitle file contains characters with macrons, these characters are replaced with about three underscore’s worth of blank space.

    Here’s a screenshot example where “Hāfez” was replaced with “H fez”:
    http://img543.imageshack.us/img543/3728/tormaidlastexileginyoku.png

    Any ideas on the cause? Thanks in advance for your help.

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      It could be something to do with the font. Did the fansubber say you need the font downloaded to watch their releases?

      • HanDuet

        Good suggestion. Just for clarity, here is the source of the media file in question:
        http://www.tormaid.com/2011/10/last-exile-ginyoku-no-fam-01/

        And here is the dialogue line that’s not showing up properly:
        “We’re going after Premier Luscinia Hāfez of the Ades Federation!”

        I’ve looked around, but I can’t seem to find anything from the fansubber about needing specific fonts installed. So, I extracted the .ass file from the .mkv, and discovered this:

        [V4+ Styles]
        Format: Name, Fontname, …
        Style: Dialoge-Alt,Tallys, …
        Style: Dialoge,Tallys, …

        This seems to indicate that the font used for dialogue is “Tallys.” I downloaded and installed this font, but the problem persists.

        For a final test, I copied the problem dialogue line from the .ass file and pasted it in a Word document. I then set the font to Tallys to see what would happen. I discovered that all characters EXCEPT the “ā” changed font to Tallys. This seems to indicate that the Tallys font lacks the “ā” character.

        Solutions?

  • ~J

    Hi, first, I have to say that this is an awesome blog, keep up the great work!
    Well, I have followed this guide step by step, I installed MadVR and ffdshow too, but the osd keeps in 8 bit, in the two sides.
    I’ve checked the steps and I have done well, do you know what’s going on?
    And other issue, the file has various subtitle tracks, but i cant choose, the only track is English, but I open the file in VLC and it lets me choose, I cant see what i have done wrong.
    Thanks.

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      Have you tried our trouble shooting section?

      • ~J

        Yes, I saw the troubleshooting section.
        It wasn’t a configuration problem at all, it was the video, I downloaded a video in true Hi10P and it runs smooth.
        But my OSD has more text (http://i.imgur.com/vdmfX.png) can you check it out and see if everything’s okay?
        Thank you for the quick feedback.

        • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

          It seems to be playing Hi10P back fine. What file was you using before which was supposed to be using the format ‘Hi10P’?

          • ~J

            A 1080p mkv version of the Black Rock Shooter OVA, it wasn’t on 10bit, it was my fault, I think.
            Thank you so much for the help, now I can watch anime in true HD, and the 8 bit files look better now.

          • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

            Glad we could help! Also which fansubber of BRS OVA was it?

          • ~J

            Coalgirls.

  • Montu

    This probably has been asked at some point.
    My laptop can generally play most h264′s in 8bit without an issue, sometimes VLC plays without any issues when MPC-HC & CCCP has some hiccups every now and then.
    With 10bit, I have used SMPlayer, CCCP (ffdshow), LAV, CoreAVC and MadVR. Some work better than others but then the audio usually chokes up if my laptop can keep up with the video.

    I have an HP dm1z, which has an AMD E-350 with an Radeon HD 6310. It is just my laptop was never really meant for processing heavy usage or am I just failing at this?

  • Fabien4

    I see that this page is still referred to. Could you add (somewhere visible) that CCCP works out of the box since the 2011-11-11 version?

    Thank you.

  • fulun

    “Note: The MPC-HC internal renderer uses the same exact rendering code as DirectVobSub, except it’s also multi-threaded. Everything that DirectVobSub can play back, MPC-HC can too! It is not bugged or lacking.”

    LOL, I can’t believe someone who doesn’t even know that these two subtitle renderers, even though using same rendering engine, work COMPLETELY differently and give COMPLETELY different outputs, is writing playback guides for people! /facepalm
    MPC-HC’s subtitle renderer is considered as “broken” by most fansubbers who know what they are doing and no one in his right mind should use it, typical example:

    http://afternoonnapsempire.org/subtitle-renderer-matters/

  • miracles

    Why i can’t set my ffdshow video decoder merit to:normal?

    After I set it to normal and I close the settings and then I go back to ffdshow video decoder is always back to default.

    • HanDuet

      I noticed the same thing. I haven’t run across any problems caused by ffdshow (yet)… but I too find this inability to change the video decoder merit settings to be puzzling.

  • miracles

    Why i can’t set my ffdshow video decoder merit:normal?
    After I set it to normal and I close the settings and then I go back to ffdshow video decoder is always back to default.

  • Smoker34

    Hello, how can i tell if my pc is powerful enough for the madVR ?
    Also, thank you for this guide. :)

  • oa127

    How do I change subtitle delay interval for external subtitles [.srt or others] if I don’t use directvobsub? MPC-HC never changes anything, the madVR and Haali’s tray icons don’t have anything that changes the subtitle timing.

    Most people will use embedded subs for this build, but I have an external .srt file that is 40 seconds off and I can’t change the timing.

  • Rik

    I have some Hi10p content I’d like to convert and burn to DVD. Unfortunately, any re-encoding always ends up creating the “Green Screen.” I’ve tried ConvertXtoDVD, Any Video Converter, and SUPER wouldn’t even touch it. What can I do?

    • Rik

      Ok…I found this version of Handbrake that does the job. :)

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  • Ardeshir

    Hi
    I can’t play my file (Hi10 p) with Windows Media Player.
    Is there any codec for play them.
    PS:
    I have CCCP the least version.

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      Please switch to MPC-HC, the one that comes with CCCP. If you have any more problems, please read this guide.

  • LilyIsDead

    THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!

    I’ve had pixelation problems with high quality videos for a long time, and this method worked like a charm!! I really can’t thank you enough!

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      I’m glad we could help.

  • Bacchus

    Thanks, works like a charm!

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  • glens nicholas

    Excuse me , I was following your guide just now to watch 1080p 10bit madoka (felp) . and it’s still lagging a bit .. is it because my computer isn’t strong enough to handle 1080p ? :( I spent around 3 days downloading this , and I don’t want all of it to go for naught .. (I can play 720p 10 bit releases just fine with VLC btw , but 1080p is severely bad in VLC so I googled for alternative .. found out that MPC is the best one . I followed your setup and it’s still lagging .I also changed the output between EVR CP , VMR 9 renderless and Haali but none work flawlessly .. )

    here is my spec :
    -HP Pavilion dm1 notebook PC
    -processor :genuine intel (r) CPU U4100 @1.30 GHZ
    RAM 2.00 GB
    System Type 32 Bit

    any help is REALLY appreciated .. I just want to watch it without lag (with reasonable quality ) . I don’t mind converting it to 720p if that’s the only alternative (but I don’t know how to do it so the end result is the same quality like the original .only the resolution is changed , no other details like framerate , bitrate etc. and does converting retains subtitle ?) .. my notebook screen isn’t that big anyway . 1080p is overkill (720p almost cover all of the screen) .I just can’t find any Madoka 720p 10 bit bluray release that isn’t FLAC (My internet’s slow so I don’t need FLAC’s audio). so I settle for 1080p .. but the result is this :(

    thanks !

  • Demmoorgo

    Hello! Just want to say thank you for this interesting article! =) Peace, Joy.

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  • miracles

    Why can not I make a video decoder ffdshow merit to be normal?

    Every time I close and reopen the ffdshow video decoder settings back to default.

  • zzz

    I have figured out how to make LAV worked in Zoom Player and play 10-bit without frame rate drop
    Go to options->switch to advanced mode->expand playback and choose smartplay->Audio & Video Decoders Tab->select H264->click configure->Save a new profile->Give a name ie LAV Video Decoder->Under Decoding Filter(s), remove any filter(s) and add filter. Search for LAV Video Decoder. Click profile priority up and make it until the top in the list. Then click Ok. Click ok again, then play the 10-bit :)

    • kumegane

      wow that works. thanks.

  • Sean

    Wow, thanks for the guide. I re-transcoded my entire DVD library to 10 bit and figured it would be a pain to get the HTPC reconfigured right. Your approach to it is simple, clean, and elegant.

  • iza

    It written on the guide: “Creating Direct3D device failed (8876086c): Go to your output configuration and change the video renderer from madVR to something like EVR Custom Pres”
    —-

    However, MPC wouldn’t give me the option to select all of EVR’s renderers. How to enable it? >.>;

    • a

      Install latest .net framework?

  • zzz

    I use CCCP, and without unsintalling it, I instal LAV Filters as instructed in this tutorial. Next, when I want to play 10-bit video, beforehand I did Step Two: Configuration (skipping the MadVR). And when I play the videos, no subtitles issue, and my netbook can render it perfectly without frame rate drop! The only issue I found so far is, the MPC would gone error whenever I play .AVI. But the issue could easily be solved with removing LAV Audio and Video from options->external filters (no need to uninstal it!). Yes this makes a little extra work when I want to play 10-bit videos, but it’s a lot better (and faster lol) rathar than using ffdshow. When I use ffdshow, I’m suffering painful great frame rate drops. Now, I just want to ask how to set LAV to work with Zoom Player (v8). Ty for the tutorial! It introduced me to LAV filters and now I can play 10-bit anime just fine!!

  • Nick

    I followed this guide and everything worked perfectly the first day, but the next day I started experiencing problems with my videos. For example the video occasionally lags for a second and sometimes the audio will start repeating over and over again for a few seconds. Like someone could be saying something like “Good Morning” and the person will end up saying “Good Morning Morning Morning Morning Morning Morning”. I never experienced this problem before. It only happens on some videos and lasts a few seconds. Any idea why it’s happening and how to fix it?

  • Anonymous

    Guze :
    May be a stupid question, but will any media player classic (or any other player) ever get native support for this or is it somehow impossible? I’m a noob at this stuff.

    Read back. BillyC commented on your query on December 7th, 2011.

  • Ishyg

    Wonderful guide, but I’m a bit curious. At the very beginning, an instruction was to delete “Uninstall ALL instances of MPC-HC, CCCP, ffdshow, madVR, Haali, K-lite, CoreAVC etc. you might have on your system.”

    Shouldn’t these be reinstalled afterward? Or would conflicts arise and fuck everythang up?

    • nand

      You won’t need them afterwards.

  • Phantom

    thanks for the guide really helped

    also i like the annie and tibbers pic up top nice to see more and more people getting into league of legends =D

  • Guze

    May be a stupid question, but will any media player classic (or any other player) ever get native support for this or is it somehow impossible? I’m a noob at this stuff.

    • nand

      They will. I think the MPC-HC SVNs already have support. It’s just a matter of the changes taking years to hit downstream and eventually merge into the old as fuck stables.

      • Guze

        Thanks. I found out about potplayer and it will work in the meantime.

  • http://myanimelist.net/profile/Zero-11 Zero-11

    My Core2Duo E7400 (2.8Ghz) runs at 40% CPU load (80% for 1Core) :(

  • iza

    i followed the guide but i get a black screen when opening the 10Bit file. >_>

  • WSZ

    I’ve been trying to fix the lagging and sync issues on my 10bit mkv videos for ever and this guide fixed it right up. Thank you, you magnificent person you. Now I can enjoy high quality Japanese Toku and Anime is beautiful 10bit.

  • Hax

    I love how fan-subbing has harbored a new form of elitism… Yeah WHO uses an outdated PS3 for watching movies on… Juvenile mentality. Whatever. Your time and money. It’s what changed my attitude to leech for most of the fan-subbing groups.

    10bit encoding, sounds like a good idea. Tech isn’t implemented completely yet, bunch of videophiles making decisions for us normal people. GG.

    • nand

      I think you meant “seed”, not “leech”.

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      Best comment ever.

    • Alex

      Oh great another one… The reason most fansubbing groups changed to 10bit is a lot more simple than some people like you seem to think. There’s more advantages to disadvantages. That’s it.

      Since when did fansubbers care about the ps3 etc? It’s not like everyone was like “oh hai lets choose a format which has the highest compatibility so some people can play their anime on their ps3s”
      It’s never been like that. If fansubbing groups thought compatibility was more important than quality then fansubbing would never have evolved from Avis… Get your head out of your ass and actually look into what’s so great about 10bit H.264.

      Oh and btw “us normal people” Makes it sound like the people complaining about 10bit outweigh the people who wanted it. Which is complete and utter bull shit. Just take a look at torrent downloads for 8bit/10bit anime since the implementation of 10bit in fansubbing.

      Why are you even looking at a how to guide for 10bit if you’re so against it anyway? Just download your 8bit anime and ones which aren’t available in 8bit do shitty reencodes.

  • Firemage

    Thanks for this. I was getting artefacts with mkv 10bit files but after following the majority of your guide, everything seems to be perfect now.

  • Coder

    Can Zoom player be used in combination with madVR to play Hi10p?

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  • saf85

    Hi and thanks for the great tutorial, anime is looking that little bit better in 10 bit for me and was worth doing!

    One issue I do have though is that normal movies, bdrip, dvd etc all seem to have very low speach volume in mpc, is annoying as hell since I have to turn up volume to max on speakers just to hear what is being said, but then if some music etc in film plays it is played at full volume scaring shit outta me and everyone in house can hear… If I switch to watching the movie in windows media player it reduced the difference between speech and background sounds in film, but still have to turn speakers up loud and can barely hear it at times.
    This never once happened to me when wathing movies with my old setup which was the cccp codecs pack.

    I have done all steps in above tutrial even the optional madvr and have confirmed it is all working as it should be when playing back gundam age 10 bit video.

    doubt it is hardware since everything worked fine with cccp but just incase I have;

    intel i7 920 @ 3ghz
    3gb 1600mhz ram
    ati hd4870 512mb
    1tb hdd
    creative sound blaster audigy 2 zs

    Any help would be appreciated guys.

    • Anonymous

      It’s probably because the audio is encoded in 5.1 surround and you are playing it on 2 speakers. What you are hearing are sounds from the surround channels. You may want to play around with the configuration of MPC-HC to see how to downmix your audio outputs into 2.0 stereo configuration. I’m not too familiar with how MPC-HC does it.

    • Bunnys

      Something is trying to force 5/7.1 over anything you run if the audio is 5/7.1. (2.0, 2.1 whatever) On my config it sounds like it’s trying to output the rear left and right audio to my front left and right. (sort of what you are describing.) Anything I have that’s 2.0 works so that’s showing something.
      see image: http://puu.sh/cxCj (my bad if I can’t post links.)

      I’m guessing it’s VAL doing it but I haven’t found a way around it as of now. I’ll get back with this if I get it working with VAL.

  • Silver

    For some reason the LAV Audio and Video filters aren’t being used even though they’re set to prefer, why is that and how do I fix it?

  • yelp

    Does anyone have a Mykerinos Sound Card?

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  • Charby

    For some reasons, when am doing your tutorial on this computer for the MPC + madVR, i cant box the madvr option in output, and i can’t add LAV filters either.

  • http://www.kawaii15.com kunoichi

    Thanks you are right, I just tried XhmikosR’s build and it worked without the rest of this guide. Haven’t tried watching a full episode yet though.

  • Fedora

    Hi, just to say, great guide. I’ve followed all the instructions, but there seems to be a problem.

    I’m using:
    1GB AMD Radeon HD 6630M/Mobile Intel(R) HD Graphics integrated
    4GB DDR3
    Intel(R) Core(TM)i5-2410M CPU @ 2.30GHz (4 CPUs)
    Windows 7 Home Edition

    When playing a video with MPC on MadVR, the screen is blank with audio. Ctrl+J doesn’t seem to spawn any data. However when I change the graphics to Intel while using MadVR, it plays the video albeit stuttering due to performance issues. Do you have any workaround for this issue? Or is it hopeless for my AMD to play use MadVR as a renderer?

    I’ve checked the MadVR site and found the same problem but so far, there has been no direct answer. There’s no graphics card update available as far as I’ve looked online as the card is still pretty new.

    This is link to the post on MadVR:
    http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1505636#post1505636

    Hope for a reply soon. and thanks. :)

    • Petrushka

      maybe MadVR had an issue with swapping graphic card. it was minor problem maybe

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  • Seraph

    I’m having problems with DTS audio garbling up. Any idea what would be the cause and/or solution?

  • NoiseAnnoyz

    Subtitles just wont work at all for me. It used to be that I couldent see anything when I played a video in windows media player (its what I use) but then I installed some of these things and I was able to get it to play and see the video, however now I cant read any subtitles at all in WMP, no matter what format it is. I am stuck with using SMPlayer (its the only thing that will actually play a hi10p video for me) and even that is pretty choppy. the picture in WMP looks perfect for me, but it wont load any subtitles. help :[

    • vaho

      use AV splitter (latest build) for mkv with enabled in it (in graphbuilder) for h.264 High 10 profile – LAV video, xy_vsfilter (latest Build) and madVR and you will see subtitles in WMP

  • RandomYandere

    Many thanks for this tutorial! I’ve spent more time than I’d like to admit trying to get this to work on my own, and now I wish I’d just manned up and RTFM… well, tutorial. Thanks!

  • Xevdin

    Does anyone know how to fix the typesetting problems prevalent with Lav Filter’s and madvr? Most typesetting is always displayed wrong, following exact instructions on this guide. It’s always the wrong size. Also, whenever there is typesetting overlayed over kanji, it shows both the typesetting and the kanji behind it. Does anyone have a fix for this?

    • nand

      Neither LAV nor madVR do typesetting, or even render subtitles. Have you tried using the Haali Splitter? Maybe it’s a splitter issue.

  • Dude

    I have the “fullscreen exclusive mode” disabled and all my settings on that page the same as in the guide but I still can’t take screenshots with F5 for whatever reason. I’ve been using fraps but it captures the black bars on the side when watching a 4:3 BD in fullscreen. Any solution besides mspaint?

    • Baphomet

      Snipping Tool?
      (I am dead serious.)

  • HcDohl

    Well I just tried this guide because I can’t play fate/Zero 11 h264-720p by UTW fansubs but my player can play any 10 bit anime exclude just this shitty one.. then i tired this guide but nothing changes. . could anybody help me..

  • avantasia

    thanks! this guide is very helpful!
    mmmm but i’m having an out of sync audio when i play MPEG-TS (.ts & .tp) files, i guess this is what you call framedrops T-T. i already lower the output to Haali Renderer but it doesn’t work.

    i’m using win 7 64bit, Core2Duo E8400 @3Ghz, 4GB DDR2 RAM, Nvidia Geforce 9600 GT and the newest MPC-HC (32bit), and i’m using Matroska Splitter

    can you give a solution? ==a
    or can i disable the LAV Filter (i’m not using the madVR though) when i play ts/tp files?

  • td854

    fallton13 :
    @nand
    This guide was perfect. I played around with some of it for bug checking (i.e. leaving previous codec packs installed) and found that your guide, if followed precisely works great. I setup MPC at home on my own gaming rig and at work on my personal POS Dell. Even on the old crap Dell, following this guide got rid of the blocks and pixelation from 10-bit files. even the animated kara subs work fine now instead of strobing. Thanks. Since I started watching 10-bit on my rig at home I’ve prefered it mostly due to the file size but I can see quality difference (no dif at work though, LOL).

    I feel like I’ve exhausted every option and I still cannot get animated subs to render correctly, they flash and drop out. It confuses me because I figure my PC is fast enough;

    Core 2 Quad Q9550 @ 3ghz
    4GB DDR2 800
    160GB Intel 320 Series SSD
    1GB Nvidia Geforce GTX 460 @875mhz core

    Does anyone have any suggestions?

    • nand

      Try increasing the number of sub-pictures to buffer.

      • td854

        No effect, I’ve tried 0, 5, 10, 15, 20, 30, and 60. However I’ve just recently found xy_vsfilter and it seems to work out the issues without losing 10-bit but doesn’t let you set the resolution of the subs manually. I’m extremely confused as to why MPC’s internal subtitle renderer can’t handle it. I also noticed when working on some karaoke subs that it handled the blur tag wrong on the second line where no other player had that problem, and it persists over multiple versions of MPC.

        • nand

          Thanks for mention xy_vsfilter. It looks amazing! I’ll be playing around with it sooner or later.

          That being said, I don’t know why you’re experiencing issues with the ISR.

  • BillyC

    Actually, the new SVN builds of MPC-HC can handle Hi10P anime by itself (no external codecs required).

  • ang

    So I should switch LAV Audio Decoder to “Prefer” yes?

    • nand

      Sure, why not. It’ll do no harm (but possibly prevent some).

  • rogafufuken

    Thanks, after a month of being like “fuck it I’ve heard this 10bit shit is too complicated I’ll just wait” I finally decided to upgrade and your guide worked perfectly! Thanks again.

  • bac9

    http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/3528/ffdshowfilters.png

    Now I’m frustrated… What does it mean if I don’t have even a fraction of all these filters displayed? I have latest MPC, LAV and MadVR, if you’ll ask.

    Perhaps because I don’t even have Matroska on this list, perhaps for some other reason, MadVR filters never started working for me. Before trying to install this I’ve had smooth 720p+Hi10P playback and audio lags with 1080p+Hi10P playback. After trying to install MadVR and LAV performance dropped to absolutely horrible level – I’m getting approximately one frame per several settings with 1080p+Hi10P.

    I guess I don’t understand something.

    • bac9

      Sorry, typo here:
      *per several seconds

      By the way, is it possible to simultaneously have both a configured K-Lite setup (for 99,9% of video I watch) and this complicated setup for Hi10P releases (hello, Redline)?

      The thing is, I’m worried that creating this setup you’re describing above will leave me without ability to play all the formats I used to play with e.g. K-Lite. Can you tell if this setup is anyhow affecting the playback of other video formats, i.e. will I get degraded experience with old 8bit blu-ray releases or something else? )

      If it’s not possible to leave old functionality intact, I’d rather prefer to leave everything as it is, unfortunately. Increasingly so as a simple K-Lite/MPC-HC setup seemed to play Hi10P releases without any problem.

      • nand

        This should not provide any compatibility problems with K-Lite per se, most of the formats supported by K-Lite are also supported by LAV, and even if you do manage to somehow come across a file that isn’t, you can still use K-Lite as a backup.

        As for your problems, I have no idea. I recommend a clean reinstall of MPC-HC, and deleting the registry entries in between.

        None of those filters are associated with external stuff, they’re all MPC-HC internal filters. You might have a ridiculously outdated version.

        • bac9

          Thanks for clearing this up! :) Still, I don’t understand some moments. For instance, this part of the post:

          > Uninstall ALL instances of MPC-HC, CCCP, ffdshow, madVR, Haali, K-lite, CoreAVC etc. you might have on your system.

          After reading this, I’ve thought that LAV/MadVR setup was completely incompatible with anything else. It isn’t?

          Then what’s the proper order of installing some other product simultaneously with a Hi10P setup? Should I uninstall absolutely everything, install Hi10P setup first, and install e.g. K-Lite after that? Wouldn’t it break something in a Hi10P setup?

          ***

          > Note: You can skip this step if your PC isn’t very powerful! Download the latest version of madVR

          How much powerful, exactly? I’ve tried searching the web, but, surprisingly, literally no one ever mentions the actual system requirements for Hi10P video. What CPU/RAM/GPU do I need to watch e.g. 1080p?

          I have a dual-core AMD Athlon 64X2 2.8Ghz, 4Gb RAM, GeForce 8800GTS512 and Win7 x64. Never had a problem with playing 1080p video, but that was with K-Lite and that GPU acceleration option enabled (DVXA? sorry, I don’t remember how it’s called – that one that’s offered during K-Lite installation). I’m not sure I should install MadVR as my CPU is extremely far from all these fancy Sandy Bridge models (perhaps the smooth 1080p experience was achieved massively due to GPU help).

          Can you give an advice on what should I install?

          ***

          I’ve heard that besides Hi10P, LAV is associated with good NVidia GPU support. As far as I know, Hi10P is completely irrelevant to that as GPUs can’t work with such video, – but I suppose I can benefit from using it with other video types.

          Can you please tell me about that area? How to enable GPU acceleration in LAV/should I disable it every time I play a Hi10P video/is GPU support featured in LAV by default or I should download something additional, etc.? Sorry, have absolutely no clue about all that. )

          • nand

            >After reading this, I’ve thought that LAV/MadVR setup was completely incompatible with anything else. It isn’t?
            No, that line is just there to prevent a flood of issues related to existing conflicts and fucked up settings. The correct order is to install K-Lite first, then follow this guide.

            About your performance, it’s fine. That line is just for the people with onboard graphics cards and netbooks. a 8800GTS will be more than enough to handle madVR.

            CUDA acceleration is present in LAV Video by default, to enable it open up the LAV Video settings and set “Hardware Decoder” from “None” to “CUVID”. I don’t know if it auto-detects whether or not something is CUVID-compatible, but I’m guessing it will.

  • sandoe41

    This is probably an issue with my computer, but my solutions may help others with similar problems with playing Hi10p.

  • sandoe41

    Even after following the directions step by step several times, the only two ways I have found to play back effects rich karaoke [such as Dog Days BDs] for Hi10p cleanly is to set the subtitle resolution to 640×480, or use MPC-HomeCinema.1.5.2.3456.x86 to copy the subtitles to an ass. file and play off that or remux it.

  • adfadfsdfsa

    Does the new release of CCCP dither everything down to 8 bit before rendering.?

    • nand

      They all do that, the problem is just when dithering incorrectly as CCCP has done for quite a while. It might be fixed by now though, I don’t know.

  • mhm

    Thank you very much for this, it worked perfectly :)

  • mhm

    Thank you very much for this :)

  • fallton13

    @nand

    This guide was perfect. I played around with some of it for bug checking (i.e. leaving previous codec packs installed) and found that your guide, if followed precisely works great. I setup MPC at home on my own gaming rig and at work on my personal POS Dell. Even on the old crap Dell, following this guide got rid of the blocks and pixelation from 10-bit files. even the animated kara subs work fine now instead of strobing. Thanks. Since I started watching 10-bit on my rig at home I’ve prefered it mostly due to the file size but I can see quality difference (no dif at work though, LOL).

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  • Pra7ul

    Thank’s a Lot. ^

  • malih

    thank you, thank you very much, finally off to watch Bakuman 2 without funky pixels,

    I just found out about madVR from your tutorial, and I watched my non-10-bit SD Videos, and they look great with madVR, must be the upsampling or something.

  • backpacker

    Yesterday i was playing [Coalgirls]_Tears_to_Tiara_02_(1920x1080_Blu-Ray_FLAC)_[D4000544] just fine, but then today when i tried watching it, the styled subs because SUPER small and unformatted. If i use the default style its the size it should be but not styled. What happened to cause it to lose its styling?

  • JustinSane

    Here’s a thought: stop encoding video in formats people cannot play. Unlike some, allot of us are using media centre pcs, and media playback devices that don’t support pointless formats.

    These retarded decisions are fine for those few that use heir laptops for playback, and can just update filters etc.

    But for people using a TV with PC software such as boxee or XBMC, using hi 10 is a fucking stupid idea.

    This is not the first time anime groups have adopted a new format way too early. It’s elitist bull shit, and doesn’t make them look clever at all. It just makes them look like fucking idiots.

    • Petrushka

      >stop encoding video in formats people cannot play

      stop downloading anime in formats idiot can’t play

      >allot of us are using media centre pcs

      u sure? most of us watch anime in laptop / PC. it’s ur stupid plastic toys that can’t play 10-bit videos.

      • Anonymous

        @Petrushka
        What’s the point in watchin 1080p movies on a laptop??? I see JustinSane’s point that there are a lot watching these movies on big TV screens for a really nice experience… Please consider that as well instead of just dissing other that aren’t watching movies the same way you do.

        • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

          Well, if your screen res is 1080p or higher, there is a point. Also watching movies/shows on a big TV screen is no problem. Just hook up a HDMI cable to your PC/Laptop > TV. Also personally I would build a HTPC over media playback devices like Popcorn Hour/WDTV Player/HDI Dune BD Prime/PS3 etc.

        • Petrushka

          connect ur laptop to TV, faggot…….
          it’s far better than play it with stupid boxiee

          u just have to to mplayer2 so ur laptop can play 10-bit video flawlessly

          this is how big liar he is

          >allot of us

    • nand

      This is not the place to complain about whether Hi10P should be used or not. This is a place for information about Hi10P, and a short playback guide for it.

      If you do not like Hi10P, do not download Hi10P. If you like Hi10P (or have no alternative) and cannot watch it, I suggest a HTPC as mentioned below.

  • nand

    flask31 :

    Is there a difference for image quality between dithering to 8 bit and not dithering made by lav video?

    On an 8-bit monitor, there shouldn’t be any difference since you need to dither one way or the other, to display it on-screen.

    On a 10-bit monitor, you lose quality, but that’s only a given when watching 10-bit material, using a 10-bit connection (eg. DisplayPort), a 10-bit renderer (eg. EVR-CP) and a graphics card with 10-bit frame buffer (eg. workstation cards) and 10-bit video drivers.

  • backpacker

    Do you know why i cant slow/speed up the video? Its not like i really need it but i could before but with this new setup it wont let me

  • Flossel

    This was incredibly helpful, thanks so much!

  • flask31

    Fffdshow support P010 output since 4067. Can you test?

    Revision 4067 – Directory Listing
    Modified Wed Nov 23 13:38:25 2011 UTC (2 days, 4 hours ago) by h_yamagata

    add new output color space: 4:2:0 10-bit. (P010, MFVideoFormat_P010)

    • ShadowVlican

      NAND knows… we just like LAV better

      • flask31

        The problem is that lav video can’t use filter like deband or avisynth with inverse telecine filter and that subrenderer of ffdshow is better than sub renderer of mpc-hc.

        Without these things, I must use ffdshow instead of lav video.

        • nand

          Easy.. Use LAV Video to decode and dither to 8-bit, then use ffdshow’s raw video filter to post process.

          The decoder should be the same since they’re both libavcodec/ffmpeg, but the dithering algorithm of LAV Video is not only more accurate but also higher in quality.

          • flask31

            Is there a difference for image quality between dithering to 8 bit and not dithering made by lav video?

          • Jack

            @nand

            “Easy.. Use LAV Video to decode and dither to 8-bit, then use ffdshow’s raw video filter to post process.

            ffdshow exposes a raw video filter that you can use with any decoder filter, and ffdshow itself can also decode h264 directly if your machine can handle it.”

            Yes, but could you explain to us how to do the setup for this?

            Thanks.

  • Tarry

    Hi, thanks for the guide. For the most part, I’ve got it going, but I can’t get subtitles working anymore. I’ve done it step by step and it all check out, but I can’t get it to display the subtitles properly anymore. It worked before I applied MadVR and LAV Filters. Help please?

  • yelp

    Does gg’s moshidora ep1 work for you? I can’t get it run ( but episodes 9 and 10 seem to work )

  • Macavity

    The ffdshow x64 nightly built from a few days ago is working ok with mpc-hc for 10-bit files. For lazy people like me, it is a good news. =)

    That is certainly not the best solution, but it is simple and it is working. (at least, for me.)

  • aryev

    It played well with madVr in my admin account, but the video not show up in another account… Any idea?

    N.P
    Sorry for bad English

  • yelp

    Does Reclock use more CPU or would it use less CPU than MPC’s?

    • nand

      If you set it up like I suggested, it should use the same amount of CPU, since it won’t do any calculations or resampling that way.

      Furthermore, since it’s bypassing DirectSound, it might actually use less – but I think most of the processing is done on the sound card.

  • Onaga

    hey nand, i have a little problem….

    l have a ASUS Xonar STX, but i dont now how a can set mpc-hc properly to send de input audio untouched to de sound card drivers, i read that the direcsound reders bypass the audio in windows mixer, causing dithering in the output.

    the Xonar drivers allows to change frequency, like example, 44.1khz for music, 48khz for video-music,anime…. etc.

    in other words, how a can send the audio to de Xonar STX drivers without “pass” the windows mixer( that is set always to 16bit/44.1hz)

    thanks!! y really really sorry for teh bad english,I hope you understand me

  • Anonymous

    I was wondering how I disable the media player from using GPU ram.
    http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/1137/001fb.jpg

    • nand

      Not possible. The video card is used to render, well, video. How are you expecting to render video without using the video card’s processing and the video card’s memory?

  • Anon

    I use windows media player with a different codec pack and it works fine.

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  • http://sakurahana.com wapicosuke

    hi! just wanna say thanks for the guide. thanks to you i got the subs to show on my brother’s computer. you have my gratitude. sosu ja

  • Anonymous

    BillyBatson :
    Hey Nand or any other admin, I was wondering why you guys tell us to use Haali Media Splitter instead of LAV Splitter even though LAV gets updated constantly though..

    It’s because Haali is the only one that can handle ordered chapters correctly.

  • BillyBatson

    Hey Nand or any other admin, I was wondering why you guys tell us to use Haali Media Splitter instead of LAV Splitter even though LAV gets updated constantly though..

  • Anon

    I tried installing madVR, ran the install.bat, it says it was installed successfully, but for some reason MPC isn’t detecting madVR as a usable output still. I didn’t move its folder after it was installed or anything, it’s just not picking up. Also I double-checked and I am on an admin account.

  • Anon
  • http://haruhichan.com/ asoksevil

    Thanks for this guide!

  • yelp
    • nand

      As the title bar suggests, it’s called “Graph”, first google result for “graph program”: http://www.padowan.dk/graph/

      • yelp

        Thanks.

  • mw3

    Your place is valueble for me. Thanks!…

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  • djsands

    I can play 720p 10 bit fine but with 1080p it starts to lag every so often. I have a AMD Phenom 8450 triple core 2.1Ghz, I’m using Pot Player with Lav filters and Madvr rend. I tried the way above but it was even more choppy. Any ideas?

    • Petrushka

      >AMD Phenom 8450 triple core 2.1Ghz

      turn off animation subtitle. looks like ur processor can’t handle 1080p too much, same as me.

  • 4got something

    Regarding “Step One:2″
    (Install the LAV Filters. These are necessary for decoding video and audio. Take care while installing to deselect the LAV Splitter:)

    Why not use XhmikosR’s build just like we does with MPC-HC? http://xhmikosr.1f0.de/index.php?folder=bGF2ZmlsdGVycw==

  • Request

    Just a small (IMO) request, could you make it so that it noticeable what was updated in the guide? Beside the version change.

    Like a history or easier way is to highlight the changed/updated area? I don’t know, you can be creative if you want. However I think the highlight idea MIGHT work.

    • Alex

      Yeah this would be nice. I see the guide was updated again today, I don’t think anything in the MPC-HC + madVR method was changed, but It would be nice to know. Then if something does change we can re-do it without looking through and trying to figure out what was changed.

      • blitzkrieg

        Yea an update log would definetely be helpful instead of just a change in the version number.

        @Nand or any of the admins that are watching the comments.

    • nand

      I don’t have the necessary time or dedication to publish a meticulous change log myself, but the modifications are all stored and viewable internally by the WordPress engine.

      I’ll see if I can get one of the other admins to publish it somewhere.

  • haitechan

    Thank you! My computer is not so old (AMD Turion X2) and I always wondered why the lag in playin 10-bit. Now works perfectly! By the way, Is there an option for Macs? My sister has one and some files don’t play at all with MPlayer OSX Extended.

  • Rare3k

    Followed the instructions a couple times now, can’t get 10p playback working at all. Madvr seems to be installed correctly, same with lav filters.

  • don_giro

    i’ve some issue where playing 1080p video with madVR.
    there’s a black square appear at the left top of the screen in mpc-hc.
    what should i do to remove this problem?

    it’s fine while using evr or haali renderer..

  • http://twitch.tv/thisguyjohn @JyonSalvador

    Love the guide, just used it again after I did a fresh reformat of Windows.
    Playing Hi10 anime again flawlessly!

    (ノﾟοﾟ)ノﾐ★゜・。。・゜゜・。。・゜☆゜・。。・゜゜・。。・゜゜・。。・゜☆゜・。。・゜゜・。。・゜

  • yelp

    Where do you get that program for the math curves x^2.2 or x^(1/2.2) ?

  • Aniturk

    I just want to say this guide is a great service. My computer is fairly new, so I went a little different way. I have the newest MPC-HC 64bit version. I installed the LAV decoders (64bit) turned off the internal ones, enabled the LAV external decoders (64bit) and all that unrendered pixelated junk I was getting from 10bits cleared up. Thanks.

  • For the greater good

    Nand & enthusiastic,

    I’d ran in a couple of problem, while searching for a solution I came across this blog http://imouto.my/watching-h264-videos-using-compute-unified-device-architecture-cuda/ (there about 4 different version of this guide)

    I’d been following this guide (haurhichan) and setup up accordingly, however this blog I mention seem to be quite detailed. And from glimpse it seem quite similar to yours. So what I want to know is your opinion on it? Is it the same as your but just more wordy/detailed? Is it different? Unnecessary? Better? Worse? Or “up to you attitude?”.

    Just want everyone opinion on it…for the advancement of quality.

    • nand

      It’s basically the same thing, the major change is that Haali is used instead of LAV Splitter which makes a difference for linked files (OP/ED), but that’s about it.

      There are a few things mentioned in that guide which I strongly recommend not doing though, for example the additional post processing with ffdshow (debanding, LFE crossover, volume and such). ffdshow is the worst tool for this when it comes to quality. I recommend not loading the raw video filter at all.

      And for volume adjustment, use ReClock. It has the highest quality volume scaler.

      • Alex

        This Reclock sounds interesting, do you think you could add it into your guide as another Bonus/Optional step? I’ve been wanting to Increase the volume for watching anime with my headphones and the volume increaser within Mpc-hc ruins the quality of the audio when you use it.

        • nand

          There’s no solution to increase the volume using software. Buy an amplifier.

  • Kyler

    So far I’ve been having an issue of where when I play a video in MPC-HC it likes to readjust my screen resolution to 600×800, (normally it’s 1440×900 [recommended]) and then it tells me that my computer is low on memory. And now the sound comes in but the screen remains black and my screen resolution gets all whacked out again. This is very annoying…. How can I fix this?

  • Bsav

    Hurm. Almost everything plays totally fine, but if I try to open an .avi, it crashes immediately. Any ideas?

    • Bsav

      Wow, okay, it’s not just .avis, it’s random programs that have nothing to do with MPC that are crashing, all cause of avformat-lav-53.dll

      Help, please?

  • aspa

    Hi! Can you tell me what’s the more compatible method to achieve Hi10P playback if you have 64bit Windows or there is no difference?

    • nand

      Just keep using the 32 bit version. There’s no good 64 bit alternative to madVR as of now, which is unfortunate but that’s just the state of things when dealing with closed source crap.

  • Derp

    Subs disappear when I pause the video. Anyone else experiencing this?

    • nand

      That’s normal. It’s a known issue with madVR that has been “fixed” with varying degrees of success a few times.

      • Derp

        Actually madshi said that it’s kinda weird and that it only happens to me.

  • Przemyslaw

    I did eveyrthing like in the guide including adding ffdshow bit for older contets. Video plabyack is fine, but i have problems with audio. I have 5.1 speakers system, but when I play any video file, sound comes only from my front speakers. When I used mpc-hc on its own without any external filters it was fine, all speakers worked fine. I think it has something to do with ffdshow audio decoder, but i could not find the problem.

    • nand

      Must be an issue with your mixer, since both LAV Audio and ffdshow audio have absolutely no problems decoding 5.1 material.

  • Michael

    Please disregard comment awaiting moderation. I just saw the line in Troubleshooting which recommends changing the renderer from madVR to something else when the creating Direct3D device failed (8876017c) error occurs. Unfortunately, that solves nothing for me. I’ve tried every other renderer and MPC-HC just crashes every time. However, it does play audio while waiting for me to send/don’t send error report.

    Confused.

  • Sengura

    So I went with the more complex/rewarding MPC with LAV/MADVR route. Everything looks a lot better, but it looks like my sub/audio options have been limited with MPC. With my Zoom Player, I was able to switch the audio language and subtitles where available. I noticed that with MPC, animes where I used to be able to switch from a dub to a sub is no longer possible. Does anyone know why or how?

    • Carnage

      You can change them from Haali splitter’s own menu from Right-click> Filters.

      • nand

        You can also change them from madVR’s tray icon menu which is probably the best/nicest way.

    • drunk off bacon

      I also installed MPC with LAV/MADVR, and MPC-HC still allows me to switch audio/subs if they available.

      When you open your video file in MPC, go to Navigate at the top and it should drop down a menu that says Audio Language and Subtitle Language, hover over the relative one to change. (See attached image for example).

      http://i.imgur.com/TFXvs.png

      • Sengura

        Cool, didn’t see it there. Thanks a bunch!

  • Ghost v9

    Arigatou gozaimasu! The Hi10P video I got is Macross: Do You Remember Love?; which is a old 80′s OVA. It has that old school grainy look to it. I’m going to have to wait until Angel Beats! is finished downloading to see how it looks with a modern day anime.

  • Baphomet

    Does anyone else have trouble with DVD discs? The only way I can get them to work is to set EVR (Vista/.NET3) as the renderer. With madVR, Haali and EVR CP MPC tells me it can’t handle the Macrovision copy protection. EVR Sync and VMR7/9 work, but neither menu buttons nor subtitles are shown. Besides, even if the subtitles are shown with EVR (Vista) as the renderer, they flicker like hell. Any ideas on how to fix this without using another player?

    Oh, and anyone who wants to suggest VLC is a faggot and needs to die in a fire.

    • ShadowVlican

      it’s a PITA, but when i’m playing MPEG2 files, i switch back to EVR-CP and set Microsoft DTV-DVD Video Decoder to Prefer

      it’s the only way i get proper MPEG2 DXVA playback with superior GPU deinterlacing

      • Baphomet

        That’s what I ultimately did, but it’s not really a comfortable solution. E.g. I can’t set the audio and subtitle track before running the VOB. Also there’s the problem of a VOB containing the end of one and the beginning of another episode…

    • ruinevil

      The qdvd.dll in Windows 7 hates anything that isn’t EVR, including madVR. QDVD is the DVD navigator.

      One thing you can do is get the qdvd.dll file from XP and replace the one in Windows 7, both of them in x64.

      • Baphomet

        Thank you, I will now begin searching for someone who is still running XP.

  • AlbinoFoxRacer

    The MPC-HC + madVR is the route to go! Easy 1,2,3 steps and was watching my Hi10P videos within a couple minutes. Thanks for the guide! Very very very very helpful! I would recommend this route to anyone trying to decide which route to take in order to watch Hi10P videos. Awesome job man! Love the look of the icon on the desktop as well.

  • Oi kagete

    also mplayer2 <- again CS

  • Oi kagete

    MPlayer <- case sensitive.

  • Alex

    I followed the MPC-HC + madVR part of the guide and it works perfectly for all videos files I throw at it, Including 10bit.

    Only problem is MPC-HC now crashes when I try to load a Bluray disc, I thought MPC_HC supported Blu-ray discs? Does MadVR or the LAV video filters not support Blu-ray discs or is this some other problem?

    Thanks

    Alex

  • Errald026

    i got so many probs installing this, but in the end it works, i used haali renderer, i think i’ve tried to re-do it 5-6 times then it finally works after reading many comments and found out how to solve em, at first im lazy to read them but after i got tired of re-doing it pissed me off and read those friggin comments that helps me, tnx everyone specially the person who made this guide, im grateful for it, v(^v^)v

  • Curdi

    So, I followed this guide step-by-step, and now MPC-HC crashes when I try to open a video file to play if using MadVR, EVR Custom Pres or VMR-9(renderless), and when using Haali Renderer, I can only hear sound and see a black screen.
    Any idea what could be wrong?

  • lilttleconfused7

    Thanks for this guide. I’ve a doubt. First you said to add LAV as ‘Prefer’ in External Filters, then in the troubleshooting part, you say to put madVR as prefer. Now I’m confused which one I should put as ‘prefer’. Currently I’ve LAV as prefer and when playin a 10 bit video, right click filters shows
    -madvr renderer
    -LAV audio
    -LAV video
    (Please ignore my last comment which is still in moderation which says madvr didnt show up. Sorry for that)
    I plan on playin some old 480p videos too. Should i follow the step with ffdshow filter? Would it give me better quality for old videos and would it affect 10bit video playback in any way?

    • nand

      LAV Video is a decoder. madVR is a renderer. They perform different tasks, and both should be used in tandem. Your current setup is fine. They can both be prefer, doesn’t conflict.

      Sorry for any confusion. LAV Video will perform just as well as ffdshow will for 480p content, the difference is that with ffdshow you can do additional post processing. You can do this even when using LAV Video (by adding the ffdshow raw video filter), so switching to the ffdshow decoder is not necessarily a requirement nor recommended.

  • J

    Do I have to install Haali’s Media Splitter, cause I get the correct result by leaving it uninstalled? And also, should I use ffmpeg/libav software decoder checked or unchecked in madVR? Thank you for a great guide!

    • nand

      You don’t necessarily have to install Haali, but without it you won’t be able to play back Matroska files with ordered chapters (well, you can – but the OP/ED will simply be skipped). See any modern anime release to see what I mean.

      You can leave the madVR libav decoder unchecked if you have LAV Filters installed.

      • ShadowVlican

        indeed! UTW’s C³ – Cube×Cursed×Curious is a great example of why people should use HAALI SPLITTER

  • OtakuEiSama

    hi I am Ei. Ei wants to know if it’s possible to keep on using wmp classic to play 10 bit anime with a codec instead of replacing it with another player, that Ei is not familiar with.

    Email: yellowstar123@hotmail.com

    • nand

      I don’t know but I think WMP will use the default DirectShow decoder for a certain media type.

      You could try getting one of those DirectShow configuration tools and set LAV Video to be the preferred decoder for H.264, which will affect all/most DirectShow players if you’re lucky.

  • Kamui

    Great guide, I was having some issues with 1080p video files, I was a fag for CoreAVC, now it’s gone for good from my pc! Thank so much for this great guide!

  • A certain magical leecher

    ok the first,second and third time i tried it it didnt work
    but i did it again today and everything’s fine!
    thank you!

  • yelp

    Auro :
    Apologies if I somehow missed the solution to this in the comments somewhere, but I’m having a problem at step 4 of the madVR configuration. I’ve followed all the steps up to that point (fresh install of MPC-HC, downloaded and correctly installed from all of the links provided, as an admin clicked install.bat in the madVR folder and didn’t delete it) but when I go to select madVR as my output, it’s greyed out. Any help/suggestions? Was able to complete the rest of the configuration with EVR Custom Pres as the output and everything seems to be working fine on 10-bit files. I’m running Windows 7 64-bit (yes, I downloaded the 32-bit version of MPC-HC) and will provide any additional specs requested for troubleshooting should the need arise. Thanks in advance for any assistance rendered

    “Make sure you’re logged in as an Administrator when running this! Do not right click and “run as admin”, log in as admin and run it normally!” did you ever do that exactly? It should have worked.

  • http://. .

    Phenomenal, worked without failure on first run-through. Radeon 5770, enjoying me some Last Exile now. Additionally, this bd Haibane Renmei copy doesn’t run like shit anymore, and I can finally figure out why so many people hate it. Thank you!!

  • D_P

    Any tips on how to minimize CPU usage while playing 10-bit? You don’t mention anything about that on your tutorial.

    • ShadowVlican

      because that’s not the purpose of this tutorial. Just use LAV, tests show that it’s the best performing 10-bit decoder so far. Else NAND would update this guide to use something else.

  • Erif

    Erif :
    Your comment is awaiting moderation.
    So, I followed this to step 6. I opened a Hi10p anime file in Media Classic Player, and the first thing I notice is that there is no picture. I hear the audio, but the screen in black. Shortly after, an error report pops up, saying “Media Player Classic Home Cinema has encountered a problem and needs to close. Sorry for the inconvenience.” I can either send an error report (which I haven’t done), or not send at all. When I press don’t send, MCP closes, but while the error report is up I can still use the player, even though it has no picture.
    Suggestions?

    Also,

    Erif :
    Your comment is awaiting moderation.
    So, I followed this to step 6. I opened a Hi10p anime file in Media Classic Player, and the first thing I notice is that there is no picture. I hear the audio, but the screen in black. Shortly after, an error report pops up, saying “Media Player Classic Home Cinema has encountered a problem and needs to close. Sorry for the inconvenience.” I can either send an error report (which I haven’t done), or not send at all. When I press don’t send, MCP closes, but while the error report is up I can still use the player, even though it has no picture.
    Suggestions?

    Update: Alright, there are a few more things I need to mention. First of all, I started playing around with the Output options. What I described above happened when it was set to madVR. When I set it to Haali Renderer, instead of just a black screen I got flashing colors. I don’t think I got the error message, either. EVR Custom Pres is not an option for me, so I went to VMR-9 (renderless). I opened the file and, lo and behold, the anime was playing properly. But there were no subtitles. After playing around a bit, I figured out “Round up to the power of two” needed to be checked off in order for my subtitles to work.

    Which brings me to my second point. When I opened the file, it get a message stating “The installed DirectX End-User Runtime is outdated. Please download and install the June 2010 release or newer in order for MPC-HC to function properly.”

    I’m not sure if I uninstalled DirectX when I uninstalled my CCCP pack, but do I need to go reinstall it. And why did madVR not work for me?

    • Carnage

      Download and install the DirectX runtime from here: http://www.microsoft.com/download/en/details.aspx?id=8109

      madVR, Haali and VMR9 Renderless need the latest DirectX to work, which you are lacking. madVR also needs a fairly new generation GPU. If madVR doesn’t work for you after installing the latest DirectX, use Haali or VMR9 Renderless.

  • Erif

    So, I followed this to step 6. I opened a Hi10p anime file in Media Classic Player, and the first thing I notice is that there is no picture. I hear the audio, but the screen in black. Shortly after, an error report pops up, saying “Media Player Classic Home Cinema has encountered a problem and needs to close. Sorry for the inconvenience.” I can either send an error report (which I haven’t done), or not send at all. When I press don’t send, MCP closes, but while the error report is up I can still use the player, even though it has no picture.

    Suggestions?

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  • bitflip

    Thanks for the very informative guide. Anyway, I would like to ask something. In my OSD, it shows the following:
    libav, h264, 10 bit, 4:2:0

    Is there something wrong with my config?

    • nand

      This means madVR is using its internal decoder, which should be fine but could potentially pose two problems:

      1. Switching the renderer to something other than madVR will not be able to use these, you’d still need LAV for them.

      2. Sometimes, LAV’s 10-bit decoder can offer better performance than madVR’s

      But you should be fine, really.

  • Pepe

    Greetings.

    I’ve been having playback problems for a while now and found your guide.

    I followed every step and I got to the confirmation without problems…

    Well, I do have a problem. Playback is terrible with all the suggested configurations so I was wondering if you could give me a hand.

    I have a PC with Windows XP SP3, Intel Dual Core 2.11 GHZ and 3 GB of Ram (533 MHZ) and I used to use CCCP with some slowdonws every now and then (especially when there are “announcements” scrolling in japanese). But now I only get staggering (with ALL the configurations you suggested). I’m thinking on going back to CCCP but if you have some advice I will gladly listen to it.

    Thanks!!

    • Pepe

      Also forgot to mention I have a Radeon HD 4350 card.

      Thanks again.

      • ShadowVlican

        your graphics card is slow… but you should not have staggering with EVR renderers, please report the filters are that are actually in use when playing your staggering videos

      • ShadowVlican

        nvm, just re-read your post and noticed you’re running WinXP.. GG. please try what NAND said:

        Under Output, choose “madVR” as renderer: Note: If you skipped madVR, or you’re experiencing lagging, frame drops or poor performance in general, set this to “EVR Custom Pres.”, “Haali Renderer” or “VMR-9 (renderless)” instead – try them in that order until you find one that works.

        • Pepe

          Thanks for your advice.

          I didn’t skip madVR and I tried “EVR Custom Pres.”, “Haali Renderer” or “VMR-9 (renderless)” in that order. I did everything exactly as described on the post. I got to the confirmation part with everything right… except I didn’t fare any better (it even plays slower). That’s why I’m a little concerned.

          After trying those configurations I tinkered a little on my own and sometimes the subtitles didn’t load and I ended with the smoothest framerate I’ve ever seen. But… I don’t get any of what they’re saying… So I need those subtitles. Maybe I need some special configuration for the subtitles?? And I DID enable “Auto-load subtitles” if you’re wondering.

          The thing with my card is that it isn’t being used at all. I’ve been browsing around and it seems that IT IS possible to make use of my card but I haven’t had any luck yet. Any ideas??

    • nand

      Try using EVR-CP instead of madVR.

      • Pepe

        Thanks for your reply:

        I already tried EVR Custom Pres., Haali Renderer and VMR-9 (renderless). Also, I tried SMPlayer but it stops after it plays one second of audio.

        • Kurisu

          I’m nowhere near a professional, but have you tried madVR’s exclusive fullscreen mode? It really improved my playback (at little to no cost in quality).

          • Pepe

            It did fare better… but I’m still having problems…

            I’m wondering if there is a way of decompressing the videos and watch them perfectly even if it means hacing to use some extra HD space and waiting at the beginning for the video to decompress.

  • Auro

    Apologies if I somehow missed the solution to this in the comments somewhere, but I’m having a problem at step 4 of the madVR configuration. I’ve followed all the steps up to that point (fresh install of MPC-HC, downloaded and correctly installed from all of the links provided, as an admin clicked install.bat in the madVR folder and didn’t delete it) but when I go to select madVR as my output, it’s greyed out. Any help/suggestions? Was able to complete the rest of the configuration with EVR Custom Pres as the output and everything seems to be working fine on 10-bit files. I’m running Windows 7 64-bit (yes, I downloaded the 32-bit version of MPC-HC) and will provide any additional specs requested for troubleshooting should the need arise. Thanks in advance for any assistance rendered

  • Nomake Wan

    Thanks for the guide! I see that using DirectVobSub is not ideal because it forces a dither down to 8-bit which we definitely do not want. However, if I use MPC-HC’s internal renderer I run into a series of problems that do not exist while using DirectVobSub.

    If I have “Touch Windows From Inside” and “Keep Aspect Ratio” enabled so that MPC-HC doesn’t attempt to stretch content to my monitor’s 16:10 aspect, subtitle positioning is incorrect and subpictures are also not properly displayed. For instance, Delicio.us’s release of Nyoro~n Churuyasan is my test case. The ‘Smoked Cheese’ labels are not in the right spot.

    If I switch the video frame to “Stretch to Window” it for some reason ignores ‘Keep Aspect Ratio’ and just stretches the video out. This fixes subtitle placement perfectly… but of course screws up the video to the wrong aspect ratio.

    DirectVobSub doesn’t have any placement issues, but it has its own bucket of worms (dithering, buggy playback without buffering enabled, choppy subtitles with buffering enabled…).

    Am I missing something? Is there any known fix for these issues? I’d love to use the internal renderer but I can’t deal with the whole aspect-versus-placement problem. Thanks!

    • nand

      Known bug on non-16:9 monitors, there’s an unofficial fix out but it’s somewhat unstable (JanWillem32′s tester builds).

      You can ask him to fix that problem in the main MPC-HC SVN I guess, or do it yourself. Apparently it’s an easy fix.

  • Kat

    Been looking on how to do this for awhile. Just wanted to say Thank you SOO SOO much for taking the time to type this out for everyone. Now I’m going back to my anime.

    • ShadowVlican

      indeed, this is a great guide!

  • Claris

    When I try to bring up the OSD, it looks completely different with red text instead. Is the screen in the screenshot taken only for madVR? madVr didn’t work for me at all so I had to try something else.

    • nand

      Yes, that’s only the madVR OSD. The EVR-CP OSD has a bunch of red text and a small graph at the bottom right.

  • Peekaboo

    Thank you so much for this excellent guide!

  • somefag

    This works perfectly on the video side of things just one problem i had (but solved while writing this comment lol) there used to be a button in the context menu of the Haali tray icon to open the settings.

    Found it in start menu now i can change haali to default on certain audio/sub tracks (great for all those dual audio releases (generally old anime).

    link here: http://www.sebhomer.com/blog/set-default-audio-and-subtitle-tracks-in-dual-audio-media/

  • c

    madVR v0.75 released

    * fixed: v0.74 stopped decoder DirectShow filter from being released properly
    * fixed: PotPlayer sometimes crashed when switching video files
    * fixed: internal decoders made problems with cropped MKVs & Haali Splitter
    * fixed: OSD sometimes didn’t appear in ZoomPlayer in exclusive mode
    * fixed: VP70 decoder showed video upside down
    * fixed: RGB24 input sometimes crashed madVR
    * fixed: ffdshow RGB input level detection sometimes failed
    * subtitles run through the 3dlut now, too
    * internal decoders are now auto disabled if required decoder dlls are missing
    * added option to scale Luma in linear light, disabled by default
    * RGB input with unknown range is now treated by default as full range
    * added detailed information about matrix, primaries and levels to debug OSD
    * updated libav/ffmpeg dlls

    • nand

      madVR v0.76 released

      * fixed: crash on MPC-HC exit / close file
      * fixed: OSD didn’t show properly or didn’t show at all
      * fixed: subtitles showed with a black background
      * fixed: trade quality -> use 10bit chroma option was used for luma sometimes
      * unfortunately subtitles are not running through 3dlut, anymore

  • screen_name100

    I did everything as listed, and they render perfectly. I seem to have an issue with playlists.

    When I watch a file in the above setup in full screen mode, it sometimes doesn’t properly move to the next file and closes. It doesn’t appear to do this in regular windowed mode. Wondering if there’s an update or an option I may have missed to prevent this.

    Also, can this build not render idx sub files? I seem to only be able to use srt and sub files.

  • kahlua drinks

    It was nice to read your post. Thank you for posting this piece!

  • Paper

    nand :
    Make sure to uncheck “Auto-load subtitles” in the MPC-HC options as well after installing VSFilter. I don’t think setting it to preferred alone is enough.

    Worked out perfectly!! Thanks a lot for the help.

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  • http://fhtcentral.com/ FHT

    Hi!
    I’ve been trying to add the madVR to my PC, but I simply cannot run it. I followed the steps and successfully installed it, but I cannot select it from the available DirectShow outputs.

    http://images.fhtcentral.com/misc/screenshot_20111018-1.png

    Here are the specs of my PC:

    http://images.fhtcentral.com/misc/screenshot_20111018-2.png

    Is it my graphic card? Or the lack of it?

    Thank you for your attention! :)

    • nand

      Are you using the 64-bit version of MPC-HC?

      • http://fhtcentral.com FHT

        No, it is the 32bit…

  • Paper

    nand :
    The first problem is obvious – the solution is written in the error message.
    About the second problem, it might be a bug with the internal renderer’s 3D transformations.
    Try using VSfilter and see if the problem still exists then.

    @Swaps4: Windows Vista 32bit, Intel Pentium Dual Core @1.86 GHz, 4GB RAM, Mobile Intel(R) 965 Express Chipset Family.
    For the setup I’m using them as in the guide, except I skipped madVR and in the output I had to use VMR-9 (renderless).

    @nand: After installing VSfilter and setting it as preferred in the external filters the subs show like in the picture but if I minimize the subs get fixed and if I maximize they would also look fine, but when I hit play they go out of place again.

    • nand

      Make sure to uncheck “Auto-load subtitles” in the MPC-HC options as well after installing VSFilter. I don’t think setting it to preferred alone is enough.

  • tenshin

    downloaded the latest cccp and it helped ! Thanks guys :)

  • Sapphire07

    I was wondering if you could help me. I’ve been using VLC, cause it plays 10bit files just fine for me, but I ran across a file that had trouble playing. I followed your steps, but every time I play the file it cuts of the sound randomly during the episode. That’s my only problem, it goes mute for like a second, but it does it various times throughout the episode.

    • Kelfistan

      I am getting the same problem with Sapphire07. I have installed Ffdshow, but I did not install madVR, since I don’t think I have a relatively fast computer.

      Been using kmplayer (sometimes VLC, but it’s kind of too much with the over-saturated colors) and have been playing videos fine until now since my regular player has much more occurring OS colors than usual.

      Hope you can help Saph and me, I will watch some videos that are just fine but will put off the ones I can’t play until later.

      • Kelfistan

        Hmmm…. well, I tried changing my render from the standard EVR custom Pres to Halaii and the sound cut was solved, however the repercussion is the video went behind the audio and thus it got desync. Then I changed to VMR-9. This is the best option for me. The sound problem was stilled solved and the minor repercussion is the video would lag a bit (usually at eye candy scenes like intros with effects and stuff), but otherwise when in doubt, do what I did Sapphire07 and give me your comment.

  • Lynx190

    This worked perfectly to get my hi10p going (after I gave up on just tweaking existing settings and finally uninstalled CCCP and reinstalled just the necessary stuff).

    But now I have a huge problem, probably due to the uninstall: MPEG-1 game movies (VNs, mainly) no longer play. I installed ffdshow and enabled MPEG-1 to take care of some games, but others aren’t compatible with ffdshow. I just spent the past hour+ searching and cannot for the life of me figure out how to simply force everything to go back to using the default Windows MPEG-1 decoding, which is all that’s really needed.

    • nand

      You can set up ffdshow to only be used with certain applications (eg. MPC-HC) if that helps.

      • Lynx190

        Thanks, that’s what I initially tried (and it’s fine as a workaround), but since then I discovered I had a way bigger problem, my windows mpeg-1 decoding seems outright broken now (if I uninstall ffdshow and LAV to test what happens I can’t get MPEG-1 to play at all in MPC, WMP, etc.). Re-registered quartz.dll, tried using a different version of it, etc., but no good so far. Googling, I’ve seen mentions of other people having similar problems when they uninstalled old versions of Haali Splitter (as I did when I uninstalled my old CCCP)

        Anyway, gonna start asking around elsewhere, since this really has nothing to do with hi10p anymore. I have absolutely no problems watching my anime right now, so that much is all good!

        • Lynx190

          I finally found the culprit: Haali Splitter, it was the NEW install that broke everything (everything started working fine when I uninstalled it). Reinstalled it and unchecked MPEG-TS this time along with -PS and my games stopped trying to load Haali (while MPC-HC still uses it properly). Not sure why Haali was keeping the built-in decoders from working, nor why my games were even trying to use Haali in the first place (I previously left MPEG-TS checked per defaults, but game videos shouldn’t be transport streams anyway, right?). But it seems to be all fixed now, even if it wasted wayyyy too many hours.

  • http://vokyo.com odirex

    Holy crap. I was putting up with crappy looking video for 2 weeks before I got around to looking for a fix. This worked perfectly. Thank you!

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      Haha that sucks. I’m glad we could help.

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  • Peace

    can you please write a guide for 10bit MKV to XviD conversion.. please..

    simple guide is enough for me, I already re-encoding 8bit to XviD..

    please help..

    thank you..

    • a

      I think latest build of avidemux should help you with that.

  • Paper

    Paper :
    I’m a noob with this and need some help please, after upgrading I’m having this issues.
    First, every time I open a video this comes out: http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/17/errorko.png/
    Also the subtitles and sign are oversized or either off place, like this: http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/43/error1ey.png/
    (I enabled “allow animation when buffering” so that’s not the problem I think).
    and for last for some reason ctrl+j doesn’t work for me.
    Sorry if this is no the proper place to ask this.

    No hope for me? D:

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      I’m guessing you already updated your DirectX? If not here is a link to do so, http://www.microsoft.com/download/en/details.aspx?id=35 also if the problem is still happening please state your system specs and what setup you are using.

    • nand

      The first problem is obvious – the solution is written in the error message.

      About the second problem, it might be a bug with the internal renderer’s 3D transformations.

      Try using VSfilter and see if the problem still exists then.

  • yelp

    is hi444pp going to be used at some point?

  • Carl

    Much appreciated, theese walkthroughs are fantastic if ur not very good on the subject!

  • TripleRod

    hey, thanks for the guide helped me a ton. tytyty

  • Razza

    Wanted to thank you for putting this together. Was trying to find the right mix to get my shows running good since the 10bit came out and your guide got it running perfectly. Thanks a ton!

  • nand

    flask31 :

    I tried but when I see osd I have h264 10bit–>8bit

    That’s fine in this case.

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  • flask31

    When I see 10bits movie with madvr and ffdshow I have on the osd h264 10bit–>8bit. When I use lav video instead of ffdshow I have 10bit–>10bit
    What are the difference between these two choices about image quality?

    If i use last version of ffdshow, I have no bug but maybe image quality can be less good than if I use lav video?

    • nand

      This means that ffdshow is dithering the content down to 8 bit instead of passing the 10 bit video directly to the renderer.

      While this is not a problem in itself (LAV Video does it nicely if need be), ffdshow will convert the levels inaccurately, which can result in colors (especially dark colors) that are off, or other artifacts.

      In general, I can not advise using ffdshow as decoder whatsoever. If you need ffdshow’s post processing facilities, then use LAV Video to decode and add the “ffdshow raw video filter” instead.

      • flask31

        How Can I use LAV Video to decode and add the “ffdshow raw video filter” ?

        • nand

          Options -> External Filters -> Add Filter -> “ffdshow raw video filter” -> OK and set it to “Prefer”.

          • flask31

            I tried but when I see osd I have h264 10bit–>8bit

  • rizalp

    Hi. I’m just curious why did you use madvr, when EVR custom pres + Lav Filters is enough to do the Hi10P decoding. I notice that madvr use higher resource than EVR..

    Is there are quality differences?

    • nand

      Short answer: At first I only had madVR (+ its internal decoders), but I’ve since removed those and replaced them by LAV Filters. I still kept madVR.

      Long answer: EVR-CP still has some problems of its own, mainly related to the mixer. The main problem is the lack of formats it can accept, but the second problem is that it doesn’t detect / respect some flags correctly – madVR together with LAV Video will pretty much ensure that all flags are set and respected correctly. In general, it’s just safer to use madVR.

      There are also quality differences. Most notably, the stock EVR-CP has rather horrible quality. You can fix this by using JanWillem32′s tester builds but they’re highly unstable and you need to know what you’re doing as well.

  • anonymous

    so I get a “Creating Direct3D device fail (8876086c)” when I use madVR. And when I switch to EVR Custom, I get cubes, rainbows and flashing videos. How do I fix this?

  • Anonymous

    Question: I followed this guide and set it up. But now there is the annoying OSd that pops up in the upper right telling me (it tells me when I change my vol, if I skip to another time in the file) how do I get rid of this?

    • nand

      Options -> Player -> Show OSD

      Turn it off.

  • Shiza

    first, thanks for sharing… before i’ve played 10p with k-lite codec pack, but after i try this set-up and see the difference, i think this is the best for me… :D

    and then, i want to ask about madVR setting on scaling algorithm *yeah i’m total n00b on this… i’ve also read playback tutorial at nyaa.eu (very similar to this – but without LAV), and there’s some point there about madVR scaling set-up, use “Spline” with “4 taps”… but in your set-up you leave it by default…

    the question is:
    - what’s the function of that?
    - and the difference between that scaling set-up?
    - it is needed to calibrate it? (i’m watching on 19″ LCD)

    aside from my “n00bness”, i think from the description on the madVR scaling setting (the 5 bar – sharpness, hide source artifacts, aliasing, rigging, and ither artifacts), set-up “SoftCubic” with “softness: 100″ will provide the best result…

    thx before ‘n sry for my bad engrish… :3

    • nand

      The only difference is how it looks if you watch something like 720p on a 1080p display. Upscaling is used to resize the video, that’s pretty much it. (The chroma upscaler is always used due to the specifics of how H.264 works)

      There’s nothing to be said here, it’s a matter of taste. I personally use spline 4 taps for luma upscaling, and Mitchell-Netravali for chroma upscaling.

      I don’t ever have to downscale luma so I leave that as-is.

      • Shiza

        oh i see… then does upscaling used/works, when playback 720p video on resolution 1440×900?

        i’ve tried your set-up (and the other ones) well i think it gives a slight difference, but i think i’ll leave it by default set-up then…

        and one more question, about display calibration on madVR settings… i’ve calibrated my display before, so what option should i choose? there are 4 – disable calibration controls, this display is already calibrated, and 2 other…

        thx again~ :)

  • kile it

    there some encoders that tell you before encoding you must change the 8bit to 16 than change 16 to 10bit coz the x264 have some problem when you change from 8 bits to 10 bit , are the fixed x264 that you put here solve this problem >?

    • nand

      Use JEEB’s builds or patches

  • Paper

    I’m a noob with this and need some help please, after upgrading I’m having this issues.
    First, every time I open a video this comes out: http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/17/errorko.png/

    Also the subtitles and sign are oversized or either off place, like this: http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/43/error1ey.png/
    (I enabled “allow animation when buffering” so that’s not the problem I think).

    and for last for some reason ctrl+j doesn’t work for me.

    Sorry if this is no the proper place to ask this.

    • Carnage
    • Paper

      Thanks a lot! that worked out the annoying pop up.

      and for the subs, no suggestions??

      • Carnage

        Try the EVR Custom Present renderer. Do your subtitle still show like that or gets fixed?

        • Paper

          Still persists using EVR Custom Pres., also I noticed that when the screen is not maximized it looks ok

  • l3reezer

    Can I get some help with a problem with snapshots?
    Disregarding the method of just pasting the prnt-scrn onto Photoshop or Paint and then saving it manually, I was wondering if it’s possible to automatically do that with ffdshow. I’m aware of the grab feature it has, but after installing all the stated programs from the tutorial, the ffdshow video decoder config doesn’t show up when MPC is open albeit the audio decoder config does. I fixed this by making ffdshow preferred over LAV, but my ctrl+j shows that that changes 10bit–>8bit. Is there a way to keep the 10bit–>10bit as well as having the ffdshow video decoder config show up on system tray or filters so I can implement the grab function?

    • nand

      >Is there a way to keep the 10bit–>10bit as well as having the ffdshow video decoder config show up on system tray or filters so I can implement the grab function?
      No, that is not possible. ffdshow does not support 10 bit formats whatsoever. It can only decode Hi10P to YV12 (8-bit), but that’s it.

      If you don’t mind using unstable testing builds, you can use the version of MPC-HC from https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=161047 and use the EVR Custom Pres. that comes with it, which will offer similar quality to madVR (if properly configured). I don’t think EVR-CP supports P010 though so you’ll have to still output YV12 from LAV.

      In my testing, this dithering to YV12 from LAV results in absolutely zero difference from P010. It’s just important that you don’t use ffdshow to do it.

      • l3reezer

        Okay, I’ll look into that. Thanks for the reply^^

  • c

    There is a thing if i activate the hardware acceleration in the Lav Video Decoder settings i see it uses a lot less cpu for the 8bit videos thats good http://db.tt/m9QHihsT

    • nand

      Yeah, because of CUDA acceleration. It’s only available on nVidia cards. And besides, if you can software decode 10-bit, you can software decode 8-bit, so I didn’t think it necessary to include by default.

  • BigBadBorg

    Thanks!!! I had to disable “allow animations when buffering”, and now it works perfectly fine!

    Great! Thank you very much!

  • MousE0910

    A bit more technical question. I’m using AviSynth to hard-sub my anime when I want to convert it to my iPod so I can watch when I’m traveling.
    I use a very simple script that I insert in AnyVideoConverter (I don’t really like VirtualDub):
    DirectShowSource(“name of video here.mkv”, fps=23.976, convertfps=true)
    TextSub(“name of extracted subs here.ass”)
    However, when I try to encode Hi10P vid using this, it produces gray screen with audio. Of course, I know that AviSynth doesn’t support 10bit but I know it can dither the vid to 8bits and I don’t mind dithering it for my iPod. So does anyone know how should I modify to script so the video would dither to 8bit and then convert properly? Thanks.

    • Carnage

      You’ll need to increase the filter merit of LAV Video to the highest so it gets used instead of some other decoder, and make sure only YV12 is enabled in LAV Video’s Output formats.

      If you use Win 7, you can use this http://www.codecguide.com/windows7_preferred_filter_tweaker.htm to make LAV Video the default decoder for H.264.

      • MousE0910

        Awesome. The filter tweaker worked like a charm. :-)
        Thanks!

  • Emophia

    Thank you very much for this guide, now I can enjoy Fate/Zero easily!

  • AS2023

    Hi nand,
    I’m using Lenovo Ideapad Y570 and everything works absolutely perfectly.

    So thanks you. You can count me as very pleased “customer”.

  • FredCDobbs

    So, for many years now, I (and millions of others) have been downloading anime, converting it with [insert favourite application here - I use Xvid4PSP] into an .AVI file, burning it to a rewritable DVD, and watching it on my standalone Divx-certified DVD-player.

    How am I supposed to do that with Hi10P files? Xvid4PSP *will* convert them – into jerky, unwatchable crap. MPlayer Classic (which I have used for years with the K-Lite Codec Packs) can’t handle them, and I _don’t_ want to convert to VLC *OR* watch them on my PC. I want to watch them on my standalone DVD player as .AVI Divx files (or Xvid: same/same). What do I do?

    • http://haruhichan.com seidweise

      why would you do this *tear

    • Carnage

      If you murder quality like that, Hi10P is not for you.

    • ShadowVlican

      +1.. why u do this.. build an HTPC and call it the day

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      I don’t know what to say.

    • nand

      >What do I do?
      Stop watching anime. That’s the only answer I can give you.

  • Nathan

    Tell me if the PS3 is a obscure and obsolete device, what is a good way of viewing subbed anime on your TV set?

    • nand

      Just connect the TV to your PC.

      • Nathan

        So basically if you can’t do that, use a HTPC or something like that?

  • tbdw

    I try with mplayer2 in all ways: compiling mplayer2-build-2.0.tar.xz , mplayer2-2.0.tar.xz and the binary mplayer2-2.0-linux-x86_64-glibc211.tar.bz2, but no one works: video is reproduced but with macroblocks and bad colors. I also check all differents video outputs: gl, v11, vdpau (in theory in vdpau doesn’t works, right?)… and png.

    What i’m doing bad?

    Thanks in advance.

    • nand

      I’m assuming you’re on OS X or Linux, then? If so, I cannot offer you any advice.

      Oh, and I’ve heard apparently vdpau supports 10-bit hardware decoding on some cards? Not sure about this.

      • http://haruhichan.com seidweise

        vdpau offloads to gpu which nvidia still needs hi10p support for so no, what are your specs? use gl and install from source

        • nand

          It’s just that I read somewhere that apparently the hardware supports 10-bit decoding, but the Windows nVidia drivers don’t expose it, or something. It’s quite possible I was mis-informed about this.

  • Nayay

    Little help please. At step 3, whenever I try to start a video (be it Hi10P or not) I get the “Media Player Classic – Home Cinema has encountered a problem and needs to close. Sorry for the inconvenience.” message. This is when I have madVR as the renderer. Needless to say, can’t enter the OSD too. When I choose system default for renderer, the error doesn’t occur, but of course, there are no subs.

    • Carnage

      You need to use VMR9 Renderless, EVR Custom or Haali renderer for subs.

      • nand

        Or VSfilter

  • Ashley

    I originally updated to the whole 10-bit MPC-HC x86 thing because when I tried to watch Boku wa Tomodachi ga Sukunai… everything was PINK (or splotchy green with lag)!
    So I tried the Commie playback guide (since I got the video from them) which didn’t have anything to do with LAV filters (worked with just MPC-HC x86, Haali, and madVR). It worked fine until I got to watching Kyoukai Senjou no Horizon and Phi Brain.
    Somehow after googling I found your guide and the guide worked great and all… but the files still lagged.
    Also, I can’t seem to get LAV Video to show up in the filters, even though it’s selected as a filter… not sure why either because I uninstalled and re-installed everything and followed the guide completely…
    But anyway, Both shows were INCREDIBLY choppy when panning by/across the screen or in big action scenes.
    I read up there about changing the scalers (which I figured meant resizer in Output) to Bilinear. The only way to do that was to unselect madVR and select VMR-9 (renderless). So I did that and now the pictures barely have any choppy frames at all! At least on Phi Brain. I just checked Kyoukai Senjou no Horizon and it’s pretty much okay now too (except for a bit of lag when skipped to a different part in the episode, but then I just skip back a tiny bit and it fixes itself).
    So now that that explanation is over, I’m wondering if madVR was the problem? I run Windows 7 but don’t have any awesome processors or graphics cards… could that be the reason for the lag?

    • nand

      Yes. Long story short your PC can’t handle madVR’s performance requirements.

      And no, we meant the scaler in the madVR settings – not the MPC-HC settings. This is unrelated to the “Resizer” option.

      But either way, if VMR-9/EVR-CP work fine for you then keep on using them.

  • Someone Else

    OMG I downloaded the latest Mplayer2 and K-lite codec packs or whatever and I seem to get maximum performance! No need to use mpc-hc (for the mean time it seems) now haha

    • nand

      That’s the reason I recommend using mplayer2 in my guide, it just works so much better out of the box.

      (It does have a few issues, for example the built in splitter can drop a few subs after switching to linked chapters, and libass doesn’t support some subtitle tags)

      If you’re using mplayer2 you can uninstall K-lite, mplayer does not use DirectShow codecs whatsoever.

      • Someone Else

        Yeah it’s pretty nice, but required a bit of tweakings too. Here’s what I did probably would help other people who can’t use madvr like me or something

        1. Get smplayer GUI and mplayer2 (As mentioned in the guide)
        2. Output driver = direct3d
        3. Check direct rendering and double buffering. Uncheck slices
        4. Uncheck all frame drop settings. Loop filter = Skip always
        5. Set threads for decoding = Your number of processors
        6. Set cache for local files to 2000-5000kb. I use 2000kb since it doesn’t seem to affect much when bigger.

        The slow down is inevitable to some parts of videos because its what I dunno what its called, uh heavy decoding areas(lol)? But the vid should catch up to audio later on softer parts

  • Mr. B

    I wanted to commend ‘nand’ for patiently answering these 52 million technical questions, and obviously new processes are exciting, and the quality bump and space savings is relatively noticable, but is the cost everywhere else worth it? I guess only time will tell?

    p.s. sorry for the minor typos too…

    • nand

      You can always re-encode to 8-bit for playback on devices. It’s still worth the network bandwidth you save, and will be faster overall.

  • Mr. B

    But aren’t we back to square one? Codecs, and fiddling with settings, which player had which pack, and how to set it up until the encoders find a better settings (HOORAY!). Look I’m a crazy anime collector with 4TB, and some series in both 480p and 720p, and several thousand episodes I may never have time to watch, but buying a $119 – 3TB ext drive or a $90 1TB pocket drive is better option than having to reorchstrate my entire viewing limited to only my PC just to save 20-40% of space and have better dark patches?

    I just wish they waited until the players caught up and then popped in Hi10p. I doubt WD or Popcorn or Patriot will have a firmware/software updates for this anytime soon or if at all.

    Helping save space for more illegal content, putting out a massive amount of users’ set ups and money spent on AV, making it difficult for thise with older machines to watch and for what?

    I just don’t get it. First some encodes were wildly bloated, some too compressed to play right, now we are switching again? Are the people that really need the quality really saving all their watched episodes? Again SMDH…

    Well they will be saving me space now as I ignore all the 720p-10bit releases, go for the xvid until other fans put up 720p-8bit like on some other pages…or until WD and the like catch up, so I’m not tied to the PC, thanks.

    • nand

      Get an HTPC

    • Mr. B

      It may end up that way. I wanted to DL on the PC and play on the WDTV Live (stream sometimes), nice and simple little boxes, that I can even take with me sometimes. $200 of 1TB expandable media I can take to any AV outlet in a small bag. I’m just not sure it will be worth keeping up with the tech-Jones’s, by maintaining a PC for the TV in addition to the wife, kiddies, old parents, assorted ding-dong friends and my own everlovin obsessive self, but we’ll see, again thanks for the blog and all your advice

  • The Seeker

    I installed the LAV Filters using the link you provide, as well as the Haali Splitter. I’ve noticed that LAV is handling the splitting, so why do I need to install Haali as well?

    • nand

      LAV Splitter does not support linked segments (eg. when the OP and ED are in separate files).

      Haali also has the incredibly useful tray menu that LAV lacks (it requires navigating through several layers of context menus to jump to chapters / change tracks).

      • The Seeker

        Haali has yet to appear though as LAV has handled the splitting of every H.264 file I’ve played.

        • nand

          H.264 is a video codec, not a container format.

          Haali is required to split matroska (.mkv) with advanced features, notably linked chapters.

        • Carnage

          Go to LAV splittter’s configuration, untick “matroska” box in the Input Formats tab. You can also add Haali’s splitter as a Preferred filter in MPC-HC.

          For mkv animes, you want to use Haali. It’s plain better and everyone tests their encodes against it. It seeks faster than LAV splitter as well.

        • ShadowVlican

          or just reinstall Haali, it’ll auto grab preferred merit over LAV splitters (worked for me when i forgot to uncheck LAV’s splitters during installation)

  • forzeX

    One more question. I’m going to buy an LCD monitor which uses a 6-bit colour depth with advanced frame rate control (A-FRC). Will i notice any difference watching a 10 bit video between 8 bit resolution monitor and 6 bit + A-FRC. And if yes – will this difference be high?
    Again sorry for crappy english.

    P.S. LCD – Dell u2311H.

    • nand

      There will be a slight difference, but this has nothing to do with 10 bit video.

      If watching 10 bit video on any display, it gets spatially dithered down to 8 bit, so an 8 bit display would be ideal – madVR is not capable of full 10 bit output just yet.

      However, in your case, this 8 bit image gets temporally dithered down to 6 bit precision again, which is the same as watching 8 bit videos.

      In other words, you will occasionally notice a slight flickering. It may help to set the bit depth to 6 bits in madVR, which may or may not get rid of flickering (or make it worse). You’ll have to experiment.

  • sad face

    okay, so my video is laggy after following all the steps. Is it just because my laptop can’t handle it?
    When I installed the Klite pack by accident, and played the video, it played fine except the audio cut out every now and then :/

    • Carnage

      Unless you tell your laptop’s configuration there is no magical way for us to help you.

    • ShadowVlican

      set madVR’s scalers to bilinear… usually does the trick..

  • Ayuki

    Thanks, but every 10-15 seconds the video skips sounds when I using EVR Custom Present.(Can’t use madVR) :/
    Got a solution?

    • Carnage

      Use Haali renderer or VMR9 renderless.

      • Ayuki

        Haali renderer plays only sounds and on VMR9 renderless it’s like a slideshow.

        • nand

          Sounds like your PC just can’t decode the video then. Are you sure LAV Video is being used? Since that’s the fastest 10 bit decoder, your only option is re-encoding to 8 bit and using DXVA/CUDA.

  • Macros74

    Question: 10P anime now plays fine, but whenever I play back a “regular” tv series episode (x264, HDTV, 720p) with MPC-HC I have lagging video, mainly it seems to happen when watching it full screen, on my laptop. Anyone know what causes this?
    It was not an issue with my previous CCCP/MPC-HC installation, the only changes made were switching to madVR.

    • nand

      Maybe the upscaling is too intensive for your system, tried changing the scalers to bilinear?

      • Macros74

        Hmm, at first glance that seems to do the trick, thanks. Strange that it wasn’t an issue with CCCP. Are there any drawbacks with using bilinear settings by the way?

        • nand

          Lower quality.

        • Carnage

          As long as your monitor’s resolution is near the video resolution, there isn’t much of any drawback. You’d need robotic eyes to tell much of a difference other than induced placebo sense of quality.

  • Aioli

    I followed the MPC-HC + madVR guide and it works quite well, but I’m sort of a updater freak, and I like having much programs up to date, so… How does updating work for this setup?

    Can I just install new Haali/LAV/MPC/madVR on top of the old ones once they are released, or would this ruin it?

    • nand

      MPC-HC, LAV and madVR are available in archive form – just extract and overwrite the old versions, it works fine.

      I’m not exactly sure how easy Haali is to update, I’ll have to try it out sooner or later.

      • Aioli

        Well that sounds just perfect, I used to use CCCP just because it was so simple, but it seems to have fallen behind lately, good to know that updating most things here should be a cinch, let’s just hope that Haali will be the same way.

        Thanks for the quick response too, I really love what you’re doing here with this guide! <3

  • Sure

    Step 1. Throw away your WDTV/POPCORN/ETC
    Step 2. Throw away your video card

    Step 3. Waste more power on pure CPU decoding.

    Step 4. Enjoy your anime on a small computer screen instead of your nice TV.

    I can see the benefits of this awesome new trend.

    • nand
    • FredCDobbs

      I agree: this is crap. This is what happened with .MKV – only much, much worse. A small, elite group of bleeding-edge tinkerers decide ON THEIR OWN to _compel_ the massively installed-base of viewers to suffer along and change our viewing habits/preferences by all going out to buy 42″ plasma monitors and use them as our TVs. I for one will simply stop watching anime first. F#@& this…

      • ShadowVlican

        and it’s thanks to them we don’t have to download DVD/bluray disc images… WDTV/POPCORN/ETC was created for the previous generation of codecs… time for an upgrade, Hi10P is bleeding edge, so you’re act the mercy of WDTV/POPCORN/ETC hardware manufacturers..

    • ShadowVlican

      1) never trusted WDTV/POPCORN/ETC because users are locked in their updates
      2) actually had to buy a better video card for madVR
      3) i’ll admit this one.. GPU does it more efficiently, but support is flaky
      4) i’ve gotta 42″ hooked up to my HTPC

  • http://www.simukonda.co.uk Loz

    If its still laggy for anyone – Play the video in fullscreen mode.

    Dont know why, but I found that in normal window mode some videos lag, but full screen and they run smoothly with no problems.

  • lawl

    Updated my codecs and everything, but the audio cuts off every couple seconds. The video plays fine. Help?

    • nand

      Guessing it’s a performance issue, what do your queues and render times look like?

  • TadeshiED

    Okay, sometimes, my videos play flawlessly, and then for other videos, they are laggy..and it’s frustrating because then I switch over to VLC and I end up watching it in a shittier way…help?

    I’m using MPC-HC

    • Carnage

      It’s impossible to help people if you do not provide at least your system configuration. We can only do so much with guesswork to figure out where the problem is.

  • Saberspeed

    Hi thanks for the cool set up :O I just have a question in mind though, why is it though if I were to put EVR as the output instead of madvr my video runs better? Can you please tell me the reason? -Please and thank you :3

    • nand

      Because madVR requires a more powerful computer. It’s basically that simple.

  • Zoeff

    Any particular reason why VLC isn’t recommended? I quite like the download and play part of that. :-)

  • weesnaw

    It would be greatly helpful if you could include what thinks to check/uncheck when installing Haali’s Media Splitter and the LAV filters.

    • Carnage

      Check everything. You don’t want to use LAV Splitter for MKVs, though, so you should uncheck matroska from LAV Splitter’s configuration after installing it.

  • Nk13

    My laptop is no a powerhouse but is it possible to customize pot player to its best whit an Intel 4 series express chipset family.

  • lahUV

    I followed the guide step by step and finally, yeah it works!! Thank you very much. ^^

  • Nk13

    Thanks for the info.

  • JZero

    Hi.
    i see you changed the MPC-HC tutorial,before the MadVR was the video decoder and Lav decoders was not necessary,you can tell me te difference between the two methods ?
    Because now i tried this version and dont look well.

    • pururin

      From my tests, LAV decoder use less CPU(which is good) than Madvr internal decoder.

    • nand

      LAV Video is better. That’s all you need to know.

      • c

        nand one thing can you put a changelog of the guide, because version number change very quick

        • nand

          That would be impossible since I made so many many changes that I don’t even know all the things I changed.

          Either way, the most recent, important changes were the inclusion of LAV Filters (3.0), updating the Haali splitter link to CoreCodec’s version which was a bit more recent (3.1), and some other link updates to newer versions (these still get a minor version number)

  • The17thNoah

    WOAH!!! It worked! Thanks^^

  • Human

    Does anyone know why does my MPC-HC crashes after 1-3secs the video file is being played? This only happens when I’m using madVR. It works fine with Haali Renderer and others.

    OS: WINDOWS 7 Ultimate
    CPU: AMD Athlon 64 x2 dual core processor 3600+(2 CPU),1.9ghz
    RAM: 2GB
    GPU: Nvidia Geforce 9600 GT

    • Human

      Can someone please reply to me?

      • nand

        Don’t use madVR then?

        • Human

          I want to know why does it crashed when I use it while everyone else is not facing this problem

          • Carnage

            Update your system’s drivers and DirectX is basically all the advice we can provide. You can also try to tinker with some of the settings in madVR and see if any of those fixes it, but it’s hard to debug this on our side.

  • erru

    why i cant play 10 bit video?

    i always got :
    madVR Reports :
    Creating Direct3D device failed (8876086c)
    and the video is black, but sound is still alive

    need help

    • nand

      I might as well add this to the troubleshooting section since a lot of people have been getting it.

      • erru

        hmm…
        did it an unknown problem?
        or still searching the problem instead?
        i really really need 10 bit player asap.
        cz tomorrow Fate Zero will release 2nd Episode @_@

        • nand

          No, it means that your PC is shit. Use EVR-CP instead of madVR.

      • erru

        i really really need the 10 bit video cz tomorrow Fate Zero release 2nd episode T_T

        • Carnage

          You don’t NEED madVR to watch 10 bit videos, any other renderer will do a decent enough job with it. Just use Haali renderer instead.

  • forzeX

    After installing madVR and everything else and making all the changes i found this : after pausing video the subtitles are disappearing after 2-3 secs. Then after unpasuing they are appearing. So the only problem is how to make them not disappearing while pausing video (sorry 4 crappy english, not native language).

    • nand

      That’s normal behavior of madVR. If you don’t like it, complain to madshi. He’s been working on the issue though.

    • Carnage

      They don’t always disappear. If you’re desperate for it you can try pausing/unpausing quickly until it doesn’t disappear. =P

  • http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Tropers/Djmaca The Moondoggie

    Do you know any converters that are now compatible with the 10bit encode? And before any smartass tells me to google it: I tried.

    If possible, do you know any converter that can be updated by installing 3nd party codec packs like K-Lite or CCCP?

    • nand

      Decode to something like huffyuv or other lossless codecs using ffdshow, then encode using x264. I’m not exactly an encoder though.

      Can’t you use x264 or avisynth to decode using DirectShow directly?

      • The Moondoggie

        Haven’t really tried it yet since I haven’t much time experimenting on them. I recently got some tips on how to encode so I might try it when I do find time.

    • Carnage

      Any of the converters which are just a GUI front-end for FFmpeg-based decoder chains should be compatible if you just replace their ffmpeg and mplayer binaries with the latest versions. AviSynth with DirectShowSource can work but there’s a chance that some other non-10 bit compatible decoder like the MS decoder is used due to filter priority issues.

      Short answer: Mediacoder: http://www.mediacoderhq.com/dlfull.htm

  • Nk13

    Is there a way to make this work in windows media player.

    • Carnage

      No. You could maybe force the decoder filter to be used in WMP, but that’s it. It won’t ever use madVR. Do yourself and the world a favor and stop using WMP for videos. You can only get the lowest of qualities in WMP.

      If you are that desperate for a pretty interface, go use PotPlayer.

  • FaulPern

    Thanks for the guide! One question though, since Haali media splitter is the only renderer (or am I wrong) that supports mkv linking, is there anyway to get it to work with madVR?

    I’m one of the few who enjoys OPs and EDs when watching any kind of show, but I guess I’ll have to contend with playing them separately (which makes me feel kinda dumb).

    • Carnage

      Haali splitter and Haali renderer are two separate things. For MKV segment linking, you only need the splitter. If you install it correctly it should load automatically for all your MKV files. If it doesn’t you can add Haali Media Splitter to MPC’s External Filters list and set it to Preferred. Make sure to set the splitter’s options “Try to open linked files” and “Merge all segments” are set to Yes.

      There’s another splitter other than Haali which supports segment linking but it’s work in progress.

      • FaulPern

        Hmmmmm, still doesn’t work… I anything I should tick off or on during installation? Or maybe some things I should make sure are uninstalled?

        I was using CCCP before…

      • FaulPern

        Got it! Had to disable the MPC-HC internal Matroska filter.

  • Someone Else

    Hello I followed everything you said up to step two:configuration and download the MPC-HomeCinema.1.5.3.3751.x86.exe but all I get is a blank black screen while sound plays fine. Then windows debug will close the player forcefully

    Can you help me please?

    • Carnage

      Give your PC configuration (OS, CPU, RAM, GPU). Also, post the debug message.

      • Someone Else

        Wow thanks for the reply! Here’s some info

        OS: WINDOWS 7 Ultimate
        CPU: Genuine Intel(R) CPU T2060 @ 1.6GHz
        RAM: 1GB (894 usable)
        GPU: ATI Radeon Xpress 200M Series

        And here’s the debug message. It’s a bit long so I put it in mediafire

        http://www.mediafire.com/?xu8uxvxdzn1ck90

        • Carnage

          Unfortunately your GPU is too old to run madVR. You should try some of the other renderers (Haali renderer, VMR9 Renderless or EVR Custom. I recommend Haali renderer.

          • Someone Else

            Haali renderer is out of sync after a while and the VMR9 Renderless and EVR Custom crashes after 2-4 secs, surprisingly VMR9 Renderless DOESN’T CRASH when in D3D Fullscreen, well from what I heard my video card prefers D3D and has openGL issues.

            Anyways I can watch it properly now but sometimes on heavy parts (lots of animations) it drops frames instead and a black triangle blinks sometimes on the upper left corner of the screen.

            So all in all for atleast this temporary fix for this new 10-bit era should suffice. Thanks a lot Carnage and everyone else who helped make this guide

            BTW is it possible to have a loop filter here on MPC-HC? It’s that filter for as far as I believe allowed me to play most non hi10p 720p smoothly during my SMplayer days and prevented frame drops (Because if I turned on both Loop filter and frame drop, well its a bad idea)

            Also last question, is there a way for Haali Renderer to use D3D? It seems to be the most compatible but without D3D, there’s no way it won’t sync and it will end up crashing for me

          • Someone Else

            Oh wait, I used Haali Video Renderer as an External Filter set it to prefer and I get almost maximum performance! But the problem is there are no subtitles well at least it does not crash anymore. I got the feeling that the subs are what slows everything though

  • SLiK

    So I’m noticing a ton of dropped and delayed frames as I play a video, what do I do to alleviate this?

    • Carnage

      Set all the scaling algorithms to Bilinear, and set the flush settings to “Flush, Flush, Don’t Flush, Don’t Flush”. Disable Calibration and Gamma Processing. See if that helps.

      BTW, the latest version of Haali’s splitter is here: https://customers.corecodec.com/downloads.php

      And latest LAV Filters 0.37 is out: http://files.1f0.de/lavf/LAVFilters-0.37.exe

      • nand

        Updated links, thanks

      • Kurisu

        I’m actually a diffrent person, but for me it worked like a charm (can’t say how it influenced the quality though, I’m not a pixel-hunting maniac). Huge thanks to the guide author & everyone providing support over here!!

      • LS

        May i know briefly what does these changes do? Trying to fix my rough playback without affecting to much on the video quality.

        • Carnage

          I could tell you, but I’d rather you try it out for yourself. If you can’t see a difference, then assume they do nothing to quality. I wouldn’t want to induce any placebo sense of quality or the lack of it in you.

  • yelp

    http://i.imgur.com/RSzLN.jpg
    Which one to choose? ( stereo headphones )

    • nand

      Choose whichever device your headphones are connected too.. if in doubt, just leave it as “default DirectSound device”.

  • yelp

    http://i.imgur.com/ELeui.jpg
    Default Sound device and Audio switcher? Are those necessary?

    • nand

      DirectSound device is necessary if you want to hear things,

      Audio switcher is not (you can disable it in the MPC-HC settings)

  • LAMMJohnson

    LAMMJohnson was here, nand is a faggot.

  • Anthony

    Followed the guide to the letter but I’m having some audio problems. It keeps crackling during any noisier moments. Plays just fine and the audio is the only real problem, thanks for the help.

  • random

    What about WMP? I have the latest CCCP and 8bit works fine on WMP. But now with 10bit all I get is a blank screen. Is there any way to get 10bit to work in WMP?

    • ShadowVlican

      use MPC-HC, it is superior.

      • random

        Thanks for your opinion.
        How can I get 10bit to work in WMP?

        • Petrushka

          use MPC-HC, it is superior.

          • random

            So no one knows then. I figured as much.

          • Petrushka

            taken from someone

            “@Umm: Yes, no problems playing the file on WMP. I installed CoreAVC 3.0.1.”

    • nand

      You’re on your own. I can’t offer any advice on WMP mainly because I’ve never used it and never plan on using it.

  • http://twitter.com/#!/SeraphimKnight Seraph

    THANK YOU! I can finally watch 10bit videos without disgusting artifacts. Super grateful, thanks again.

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      Enjoy :) .

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  • Anonymous

    Thank you very much for such a nice guide now i can watch Fate/zero :D arigato

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      Glad we could help :) .

  • Serduszko

    Eh. I tryied every codec(cccp beta,kazzalite,quickTime and others) and players(mplayer2,wmp home cinema,vlc) but still I got faded, destroyed colors. They look like shit/480p quality or even worse. http://puu.sh/6sdm and if I play a bit with colors in catalyst http://puu.sh/6sdr a bit better colors but still quality like shit. My pc is 4520s HP and 6370 HD radeon. HELP. For now I uninstaled whole thing and put cccp beta with wmp home cinema.

    Here is squid girl 720p 10p from underwater(http://underwater.nyaatorrents.org/img/squid2-01.jpg):
    http://puu.sh/6sf5 normal screen without changes
    http://puu.sh/6sf2 with some fun of catalyst.

    Here is UTW 720p F/Z
    -normal http://puu.sh/6sfr
    http://puu.sh/6sfv-with some fun of catalyst.

    Nichijou 25 underwater720p
    http://puu.sh/6shh -normal
    http://puu.sh/6sh9 – with catalyst.

    Arakawa under bridge 720p mudabone
    normal= http://puu.sh/6shJ
    changed with catalyst a bit= http://puu.sh/6shI

    Maria Holic 720p BD coalgirls
    normal= http://puu.sh/6shP
    changed a bit with caatalyst= http://puu.sh/6shT

    [DB]_Bleach_Movie_3_HD_1920x1040_[14BABF0C]
    normal= http://puu.sh/6si3
    changed with catalyst= http://puu.sh/6si0

    [DmonHiro] Ichiban Ushiro No Daimaou 05 (BD, 720p, FLAC) [BAA2F5E0]

    normal= http://puu.sh/6sif
    custom with catalyst= http://puu.sh/6sib

    ps. my deskop is bright and with good colors http://puu.sh/6sfB . So I wonder wtf.

    What is the matter?

    • nand

      Might be the range settings. Double check to see if your display device is set as PC levels (full range) in madVR?

      Also, some of those screenshots actually look /better/ in the faded version than with the catalyst edits.

  • pururin

    First of all, thank you very much for such a nice and easy guide sir!
    But there is one thing that bugs me for a while…since I lag the knowledge about these stuffs :-

    Is it better to use (1) LAV Audio decoder+ffdshow audio processor(to do channel swapping, mixer, force output 16-bit LPCM output)

    Or (2) I can just use ffdshow audio decoder?

    Is there any different or benefit?

    I saw you use (1) here in the screenshot
    and I saw people talking about using LAV instead of ffdshow
    So I wonder if there is any reason behind this decision.

    • nand

      LAV Audio connects with LAV Video to ensure your audio and video are synched properly.

      If you mix LAV Video with ffdshow audio I’m not sure that’s always the case, and could cause some problems with corrupted/erroneous releases.

      It shouldn’t have any effect whatsoever on good files though. I just use it because why not?

      • Anonymous

        Oh I see, thanks a lot :)

    • ShadowVlican

      i’m also using LAV video with ffdshow audio decoder… i prefer ffdshow for audio because it can auto-encode surround flac/aac to AC3 which i toslink to my receiver (which doesn’t have HDMI for surround lpcm)

      • pururin

        I too have some difficulties about surround flac in my setup.
        Glad to here that anyway!

        • ShadowVlican

          yeap, only those with HDMI receivers can benefit from surround-FLAC… those with older receivers must use ffdshow to output surround-AC3… then finally everyone else must downmix to stereo (through ffdshow or audio drivers, whichever sounds better)

  • John

    Does this work well with i3 integrated graphics?

    • nand

      I have no idea but I’m going to go ahead and assume no.

    • ShadowVlican

      why don’t you give it a shot and report back? if it lags, try the bilinear scalers

    • pururin

      I have mobile core i5 2nd gen (2540m) with integrated Intel HD graphic 3000
      Work really well.

  • ycart59

    Actually, I’m back with an issue. Whenever I play things that aren’t encoded to be 10-bit and I go into full screen, the animation is choppy. Outside of full screen, though, it’s smooth. I went back and made sure that everything was right, but it still does it. Do you know how to fix this?

    • nand

      If it only happens in fullscreen then just disable the madVR exclusive fullscreen mode, problem solved.

  • ycart59

    I just wanted to thank you for the guide. I’m a total idiot when it comes to this stuff, and this made it really easy for me (look, mommy, it even has pictures!). I was really reluctant to uninstall MPC-HC and CCCP, since everyone always told me to have those on there. But 10-bit anime looked like it was on acid when I tried playing it, and everyone told me that it was all going to switch over, so I had to do it eventually. I was just worried about 8-bit not playing correctly if I switched, and I’m glad that it still does. So, thanks again for the guide. I can finally just watch my anime in peace. (And I really notice the difference between 8-bit and 10-bit!)

  • qwerty

    Sorry for posting again but I forgot to mention, my i3 is a second gen sandybridge.

  • ene13

    Thank you for making this as idiot proof as possible!

    I thought about ranting about how this is unneccessary, but then i used your guide and watched fate/zero from utw with the 10 bit settings, and it looks so god damn awesome!

    THANK YOU!

  • qwerty

    Hello, I’m a newbie as far as video decoding is concerned and never actually tried to learn these. I’ve i3 2.1Ghz, 2gB ram, win7, nvidia geforce 520gt ddr5 1 GB with cuda. Currently, what setup should give me the best quality? I’d also play 8 bit videos, also non-anime videos(if that makes a difference). I’ve coreavc if that is needed. And do I have to uninstall all previous decoders for better results? I have an installed copy of powerdvd somewhere, and have seen something like cyberlink codec in mpc settings. So, I need to uninstall that as well? What about vlc, I guess I don’t have to uninstall it?

    • nand

      >I’ve i3 2.1Ghz, 2gB ram, win7, nvidia geforce 520gt ddr5 1 GB with cuda
      I don’t know if this will run madVR well, I honestly can’t judge it that well. You’ll just have to try it, or use EVR otherwise.

      >Currently, what setup should give me the best quality?
      LAV Video + madVR. If you really know what you’re doing, you can also use avisynth scripts to improve the video quality, but I’ll skip over that.

      >I’d also play 8 bit videos
      Doable just fine, especially using CUDA. LAV Video’s software 8-bit decoder is only a small margin behind CoreAVC. (And the 10-bit decoder is ahead of CoreAVC)

      >And do I have to uninstall all previous decoders for better results?
      I’d recommend it, unless you want to debug your filter graph.

      >I have an installed copy of powerdvd somewhere
      I don’t know if that messes with anything.

      >So, I need to uninstall that as well?
      I don’t think you have to, try it first – only uninstall if you know it causes problems.

      >What about vlc, I guess I don’t have to uninstall it?
      Yeah, I’m guessing VLC is fine.

  • lurker

    Just wanted to say thanks a ton for the guide!

  • francis

    i cnt find step 5 :( i already installed madVR though…

    Enter the madVR settings (easiest way is to play back some file then enter it from the tray icon), and enable the following three:

  • Esker

    I have a problem. I’ve followed this guide to the letter and it works flawlessly… unless I skip or go fullscreen, in which case the video freezes for a while with the audio carrying on, then jumps forward to where it’s meant to be. Fullscreening is particularly bad, often taking well over 10 seconds to catch up.

    Is there something I have set wrong?

    (Reposting because I don’t think it worked the first time. Apologies if I double post).

    • nand

      Disable madVR exclusive mode. It takes some time to initialize on some setups. It’s only about a second or two here, but s till annoying.

      I have it off. I recommend turning it off unless you are having performance issues.

      • shadowfirekid

        How do you disable madVR exclusive mode?

        • ShadowVlican

          under madVR’s general settings

  • TadeshiED

    Hey, you said not to download the x64 right? But I don’t see the x32 anywhere? All I see is the x64 and x86 and they’ve all be updated today (Oct. 1st)

    • shinnmoso

      Get the x86, it’s the 32-bit Edition.

  • weesnaw

    I keep getting stuttering/choppy audio every few seconds when playing a 1080p 10-bit video in both fullscreen and windowed. The video plays fine in fullscreen(laggy in window mode) and Ctrl+J says it’s 10-bit and all but I want the audio to be fixed. Help please anyone?

    • nand

      What audio decoder are you using?

  • yelp

    Would using that ti3 parser use more cpu power or less?

    • nand

      No difference. It would run on the GPU.

  • The Seeker

    “(you really shouldn’t be using VLC)”

    Genuinely curious as to why you state this.

    • nand

      Poor performance, poor format support, poor quality, not extendible, bad interface etc.

      • The Seeker

        Would you be able to substitute the Haali Splitter for the LAV Splitter?

        • nand

          As far as I know, LAV Splitter is not capable of opening linked files, and it also doesn’t have the nice tray icon.

  • crt

    i see no banding, but then again i have a quality eizo CRT and not these crappy lcds.
    actually 10bit seems more blurry, way to go – blur the picture to compensate for crappy lcd banding.

    • nand

      9/10, nearly fell for it.

      That’s because your CRT is making everything blurry (so you don’t notice the banding of 8-bit, and think 10-bit is blurred).

      tl;dr your monitor is shit, go upgrade and then talk again.

      • crt

        lol, i have several lcds/crts running side-by-side and they come NOWHERE near the quality of a good crt. you have to see it side-by-side to see the difference (cloned views from gtx560sli).
        banding is exactly the one thing you will notice on lcd but not on crt unless its there originally (try color shading tests and weep)
        on lcd its even worse on moving image, banding crawling everywhere.

  • splorg

    Hey there guys, I have a bit of a problem playing 10-bit videos, specifically audio problems. The problem is that when I play the video, every few seconds or so the audio stutters/is choppy/cuts off for a few milliseconds. It’s a small yet very annoying problem. I don’t know whether it’s my MPC-HC settings, my Haali Media Splitter settings, or my madVR settings. Help would be greatly appreciated guys.

    PS – I followed the directions on this site and the video playes perfectly, it’s just choppy/stuttering audio that’s pissing me off.

  • doopliss

    This was an awesome guide and i have everything working correctly but the only problem i seem to be having is my subtitles seem to be out of sync by about a half a second its not really much on issue but it irrates me more than it should.

    Anyway to fix this?

    • nand

      You probably have some subtitle timing messed up, otherwise try disabling pre-buffering etc.

      If all else fails, just offset the subtitles by so many milliseconds.

  • Xyphite

    After going by these settings, I am now able to watch 10-bit videos without any issues. I can also watch 8-bit videos without issues as well. Though now I have the issue of not being able select audio/subtitle tracks when I open a dual-audio video. Anyone able to help me fix this, or am I just going to have to suck it up or just use a different computer for those dual-audio vidoes?

    • nand

      You probably haven’t installed Haali Media Splitter properly.

      If you have, there should be an icon in your tray with which you can choose the tracks.

  • Andrew

    Hi, i installed madVR moved into program files but cant find the “madVR” Settings

    5. Enter the madVR settings (easiest way is to play back some file then enter it from the tray icon), and enable the following three:

    • Dawn

      Did you install the .bat file?

      It should pop up in your taskbar, in the bottom right. If you can’t see it when you’re trying to play a Hi10P video, click the expand button and look for it there.

      Right click -> Settings and whatever else.

  • Dawn

    Got it sorted, kinda. Was worried that my laptop (M1330 w/ 2Ghz C2D, 2GB,8400MGS, W7U) would struggle since it only really does 720p videos comfortably.

    Anyway, it’s all set up okay according to all the guidelines. But video playback is laggy when MPCHC is windowed, but runs pretty well when I’m at full screen.

    Doesn’t really make sense to me. Otherwise, it’s working a treat and I just need to get ffdshow and I’m pretty much good to go.

  • Gergy

    For mac, use MplayerX instead of Mplayer OS X Extended. It’s a complete rewrite, offers better interface, options and control, and doesn’t require a manual update of the mplayer codec. It’s what a universal player for mac should be.

  • ColdFission

    Great guide there, I did follow what you had with MPC-HC (1.5.3.3740) and MadVR (0.74) and worked great. Had the same OSD output as you.

    I tried out the LAV Video Decoder (0.35) and changed the Output of MPC-HC to EVR-CP and looked at the OSD and the output was NV12 color space. I looked up the color space type and it was 8-bit (right?). So, I tried the MadVR Output setting and the OSD I get now is H264, 10 bit, 4:2:0 -> P010, 10 bit, 4:2:0. I do assume that it is outputting 10-bit at that point. I wasn’t aware that the MadVR output setting would be compatible with the LAV video decoder.

    But when I tried it with the the stated SVN tryout builds in the guide (specifically using clsid builds, the rev3914 one), the output wasn’t 8-bit. This is what I saw in the OSD (Output setting still set to MadVR in MPC: h254, 10 bit, 4:2:0 -> YV12, 8 bit, 4:2:0. I tried it with the EVR Custom Preset Output but the color space was now set to NV12 (8-bit). During the install of FFDSHOW, I did set it to reset the settings to default during the wizard from the installer (speaking of settings in FFDSHOW, I haven’t touched anything other than the OSD for it). Do you have any ideas on where I am getting this wrong? Oh and, I am using the K-Lite Mega Codec Pack with the 7.7.7 update. The version of the FFDSHOW Video Decoder from the pack had the same revision number as the clsid build and the results were the same before I installed it again (ontop of the same location where the FFDSHOW Video controller from the pack was installed) from the standalone installer.

    Anyway, thanks again for the guide.

    • nand

      >I wasn’t aware that the MadVR output setting would be compatible with the LAV video decoder.

      Of course, the two are practically built for each other.

      >Do you have any ideas on where I am getting this wrong?

      ffdshow does not support 10-bit output whatsoever. You’ll need to stick with using LAV to get 10-bit output.

      • ColdFission

        Ah ok, thanks for that.

  • yelp

    Can lav filters/lav video be used for ATI? ( Just not lav cuvid, right? )

    • nand

      Yes. LAV Filters runs completely on the CPU. You can even use them without even having a graphics card.

      The only component that uses hardware acceleration is LAV CUVID, and it’s not compatible with Hi10P and requires an nvidia card.

      All of the praise people are heaping on LAV is for the LAV Video software decoder, which is pretty much the best currently out there. You can use this with ATI, nVidia, integrated graphics, FirePro, USB video adapters, whatever.

      • yelp

        How do I make the files I open with mpc-hc to show up with that icon?

        • yelp

          http://i.imgur.com/h9VTD.jpg
          ( how do I get the ones with ( 3 2 1 ) in the icon?

        • nand

          Tick “With Icons” in Player -> Formats.

          • yelp

            Using the xhmikosr 3745 one ( can’t seem to make it change to that other version though…) anything else in the format/extensions to change?

  • EVA-01

    Just a little question regarding step 5:

    I’m using the LAV Video Decoder for decoding h264 and AVC1 (with PotPlayer~), so I have all internal madVR decoders disabled. Which means that I’m getting the OSD message (when playing 8 bit vids) which’s shown in your “incorrect” image.

    I tried using the internal madVR decoders but discovered that they need more CPU power than the LAV Video Decoder. But by now I’ve come across several madVR + MPC guides, and nearly all of them (there was one exception) laid emphasis on using the internal madVR decoders instead of anything else. Is there a reason for this, for example degraded quality if you’re not using the internal ones? I didn’t notice any differences, but I thought asking one of the cracks couldn’t hurt… ;)

    • nand

      > Which means that I’m getting the OSD message (when playing 8 bit vids) which’s shown in your “incorrect” image.

      Yes, that’s fine in this case – it’s just important to note that you should be getting “-> P010” for 10 bits and not YV12, if you still get YV12 there’s something wrong.

      > I tried using the internal madVR decoders but discovered that they need more CPU power than the LAV Video Decoder.

      Interesting to know, I’ll try benchmarking them myself sometime. How significant was the difference?

      > Is there a reason for this

      The only reason is simplicity – the LAV Filters are technically better than the madVR internal decoders, it’s just that installing yet another component draws too many people away from MPC-HC. There’s no real need to place emphasis on using the madVR internals over LAV – the emphasis is there to prevent people from using ffdshow or CoreAVC to play 10-bit video.

      > for example degraded quality if you’re not using the internal ones

      You will notice 0 quality differences between madVR and LAV Video because they are literally the exact same back-end (LAV Video probably just has a slightly more updated build of libav or uses better compiler optimizations or something).

      • EVA-01

        > Yes, that’s fine in this case – it’s just important to note that you should be getting “-> P010” for 10 bits and not YV12, if you still get YV12 there’s something wrong.

        Yeah, that’s what I get. “h264, 10 bit, 4:2:0 -> P010, 10 bit, 4:2:0″

        > Interesting to know, I’ll try benchmarking them myself sometime. How significant was the difference?

        Hm, I tried to reproduce it and failed. Sorry. Seems that was an error on my side. But back then it was only about ~5-10%.

    • Petrushka

      funny that i had to force madvr renderer to “Prefer” in my XP desktop, but i didn’t need that in my win 7 laptop….

  • Witcher

    what is the best for Audio processing? FFDshow Audio Decoder or LAV Audio?

    • nand

      They should both be bit perfect, audio processing doesn’t really make a difference and the speed is negligible.

      I find ffdshow to be better because it has greater format support and customizability. For example, you can force ffdshow to use 32 bit floating point for all post processing and calculations, then have it dither down to 24 bit or whatever in VHQ mode.

      LAV is not as customizable, that’s about it though.

  • kile it

    another thing the last version of cccp support the 10bit

    so it is beater than madvr ?

    • nand

      The 10-bit support in CCCP is just tacked on top and still slightly bugged.

      madVR is designed from the ground up to support 10-bit images.

  • kile it

    is there beater decoding filter that can be use ?

    this filter is not that good , i have an old 8 bit

    mp4 file i use mpc to play it , the colors seems old

    and not that good , can i use the latest k-lite codec and

    madvr , klite package have very good filters to decode

    • nand

      Have you tried LAV Filters? It should play it fine.

  • yelp
    • nand

      No. The xhmikosr builds are the normal MPC-HC builds without modifications.

      The mediafire folder is JanWillem32′s tester build which has new features, somewhat improved code, better default renderers/scalers and so forth.

      There’s really no difference unless you use the internal renderers though, which is why I don’t use them myself.

      • yelp

        What about the speeds between those two?

        • yelp

          That’s a direct dl link.

        • nand

          The AVX builds (if you have a Sandy Bridge processor) will probably be slightly faster as well as the SSE2 builds with optimizations turned on.

          I don’t know how exactly the xhmikosr builds are compiled, but it shouldn’t really make a difference either way.

          The tester build is really just there for the features.

  • http://thai-blog.net Блог о путешествиях

    Thx for this great information that you are sharing with us!!!

  • HB

    I followed this guide, worked perfectly, however when I restarted my computer the next day, madVR was not on the list of outputs. I tried everything, it would not come back up. It was there, just greyed out.

    • HB

      NEVRMIND.

      I had some random ass codec pack I forgot to uninstall.

      Problem solved.

  • wut

    Why do you keep spamming this on /a/, then make troll posts before anyone responds?

    Also I like how nobody here actually understands the implications of increased bitdepth and assumes it’s what cleans the banding, even though it cleans banding on sources that have problems to begin with, which is the opposite of what you’d get with simple dithering (higher error tolerance).

    It’s also funny that you people write off all relatively new consumer hardware players as obscure, while watching obscure anime. What you’re looking for is “old”, and not even that old considering 8bit players are still released, as very few things are mastered in 10bit since most monitors are still 6~8.

    For people who claim to be so cutting edge and forward thinking, you sure act religiously, blindly clinging to your next grail and making no effort to understand it.

    • nand

      >Why do you keep spamming this on /a/, then make troll posts before anyone responds?
      I don’t visit /a/ at all.

      >implications of increased bitdepth and assumes it’s what cleans the banding
      It isn’t, it’s what allows us to save it the result.

      >write off all relatively new consumer hardware players as obscure
      They are obscure. Nowadays, people use HTPCs for home theater setups, not obscure hardware devices. Those are relics of the DVD era.

      >you sure act religiously, blindly clinging to your next grail and making no effort to understand it.
      I’ve yet to see compelling arguments against it.

  • Apeiron

    It’s not entirely accurate to say that no graphics cards support 10bit decoding. I’m a Linux user with nVidia’s drivers and an 8600GT 512mb. Using MPlayer2 with the VDPAU output/codec, 10bit h264 plays fine, and is hardware accelerated (tested using -vo vdpau -vc ffh264vdpau and -vo xv -vc ffh264. Notable increase in CPU use when not using VDPAU indicating software decoding). VDPAU (Video Decode and Presentation API for Unix) is the Linux approach to hardware video decoding supporting mpeg12/h264/vc-1/wmv9/mpeg4p2. Which codecs are actually supported largely depends on the card. Wikipedia article for nVidia PureVideo will have more info for those who care.

    Seems like it might just be Windows that doesn’t properly support it.

    • nand

      Interesting. You’ll probably have to ask nevcairiel about the specifics of why it isn’t available over the CUDA API, then.

  • erejnion

    Ok, what would be better?
    1) CCCP + EVR-CP + bicubic (Don’t call me normal!!! T_T)
    2) MPC + haali + madVR + bilinear (my Mobility HD3400 with 128MB doesn’t really manage better resizers)
    3) MPC + LAV + EVR-CP + ??? (haven’t tried this yet, I hope it doesnt eat too much gpu?)
    4) something else?

    for cpu performance, my c2d@2Ghz is enough for 720p@Hi10 or 1080p, but I guess I can’t hope to play 1080p@Hi10, so it doesn’t really matter

    • nand

      Option 2) will be the best quality-wise.

      Upscaling something like 720p to 1080p doesn’t really reveal the differences between methods such as bilinear and bicubic (there will be on average 1 or 0 interpolated pixels between each source pixel – when you only have one pixel of additional data the algorithm used doesn’t really matter). It’s more important for extreme upscaling like 360p or 480p -> 1080p.

      Option 3) will be better than 1) simply because LAV has better performance than CCCP/ffdshow. (They use the same decoders but LAV includes less crap. This also means you don’t need to do software dithering which is expensive on the CPU).

      • erejnion

        Guessed so, even as the laptop monitor is only 1680×1050, so there is even less of a difference. And, for 360p, I can always choose a better resizer, as 360p wants less from the gpu. Thus, my only problem is what should I use when my laptop is on battery, since madVR eats a lot… well, then I guess I should read a little about LAV. Thanks for the help!

  • Ikh

    i tottaly noob here.

    My lappie Spec

    Intel T2130
    Ram 1.5G
    Intel Graphic card

    i’ve updated DirectX to the latest
    Using 1.5.3.3666

    I’ve tried every step above except 3rd (Ctrl+j doesn’t work)
    and every i play video (Hi10p or not) MPC show ~creating Direct3D device failed (8876086c)~

    can anyone help identified my problem

    • nand

      Guessing you do not have enough video memory.

      madVR is not intended for low-power devices, sorry. Look into the alternatives mentioned above such as mplayer2 or use Overlay Mixer.

  • Ikh

    i nuwb in this kind of think i usually using Cocec pack (Klite or CCPB).

    My Lappie Spec
    Intel Dual COre T2130
    Ram 1.5 G
    Intel Bulit-in Graphic Card (256)

    I have updated DirectX to the newest update
    Using MPC-hc 1.5.3.3666

    i’ve tried every step above except number 3 (ctrl+j/the command seems doesnt work)

    and when playing video (both hi10 & normal video) MPC show
    - creating Direct3D device failed (8876086c)-

    please help

  • Kareha

    The version number of the guide keeps changing, so just wondering what you’ve been changing in the guide :)

    • nand

      If the major version number changes it’d be a major rewrite in part or in whole, I don’t intend to increase the major to 3 but when I deleted all of the original and rewrote it I increased it to 2.

      If the minor version number changes, I’m actually adding or removing information – this could be, for example, the addition of a new decoder (eg. CoreAVC 3), or the addition of a notice in the troubleshooting section. The last minor version update was because I added Mplayer OSX Extended.

      If the third version number changes, I’m not adding information content but doing things such as updating links to point to the latest versions, changing screenshots or fixing typographical errors/styling issues.

      • Kareha

        Many thanks for the explanation :)

        This is easily the best guide I’ve come across for setting up my PC for Hi10P playback, keep up the good work :)

  • Pingback: Teste de Encode 10bits « Shiroki Tsubasa Fansub

  • Samad

    I am glad to see your guidance but which encoding software i should use.Can you give me the link which encoding software you use for it?

    • nand

      http://x264.fushizen.eu/

      See also the section “How to encode in Hi10P” above.

      • Samad

        Thanks for the link.but those install program doesn’t work>If you don’t mind,can you send me hi10p in your computer by any file host ?

        • nand

          Why wouldn’t those work?

  • Cman21

    x264 revision 2074r2: http://x264.fushizen.eu/?p=381

    this build has modified the limited color range bit depth conversion algorithms. The full range algorithm is still the same, and doesn’t have the signed math for YUV chroma that irock mentioned it needing. In short: For most if not all content the algorithm specified in BT.709 Part 2 (simple bit shift to left) gets used, while the little full range content there is gets done via x264′s original algorithm (which seems to have originated from BT.709 Part 1).

    Screenshot Comparisons:
    http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/80048
    http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/80050

    also can you provide links as to which encodes CoreAVC doesnt seem to work? it seems to work perfectly for my on quite a few releases.

    • nand

      These are some good screenshots, especially the gradient comparison – it shows how 10-bit *can* reduce banding (especially artificial banding due to gamma compression).

      How are the filesizes between the two releases? If the 10-bit file size is indeed lower, it proves that we have same or higher quality for less.

      • Cman21

        The file size difference between my 1min 30sec test encode was ~4-5%, Hi10 being smaller, which is what i expected while keeping the crf and all other encoding settings the same. The encoding time also went up considerably by ~30% for Hi10, also expected.

        the MAIN reason for this comparison is to show the color shift being corrected in the nonofficial build i linked to. if you look at the first comparison the Hi10 encoded on x264 r2074 has a red hue in the black unlike the Hi10 encoded on nonofficial build that i linked to. the second shows that there is no red shift in x264 r2074 8bit encode and that the Hi10 encoded using the nonofficial build matches the 8bit. this bug in x264 has effected ALL encodes to date unless they used the nonofficial build that i linked to above.

        this bug in x264 was explained by cyberbeing, from Doom9, and he said:

        All in all, this is mainly a concern from a technical accuracy standpoint. In most cases, it would be really hard to notice without direct comparison, unless your video is very dark. The resulting error results in RED, GREEN, and/or BLUE 8bit values +/- 1 across the entire luminance range. This basically means the problem becomes more significant the closer you get to black, but it somewhat balances out with our reduced visual sensitivity near-black and the limitations of lower-end LCD’s ability to accurately reproduce the difference between say 13-10-16 (8bit source video) and 14-10-17 (madVR/mplayer2) or 13-11-16 (ffdshow/lav video).

        254-254-254 = up to ~0.4% hue shift
        127-127-127 = up to ~0.8% hue shift
        64-64-64 = up to ~1.5% hue shift
        32-32-32 = up to ~3.1% hue shift
        16-16-16 = up to ~6.3% hue shift
        8-8-8 = up to ~12.5% hue shift
        4-4-4 = up to ~25% hue shift
        2-2-2 = up to ~50% hue shift
        1-1-1 = up to ~100% hue shift

        Now if you look at all the comparisons on the post below they where all encoded using the bugged x264 and on comparison #80034 you can see this incorrect shift again. but when looking at the other Detail oriented Comparisons you will not easily see any shift. this is because as stated above in that chart only the darker colors are effected enough by this bug to be seen by an average user. but also as he said this an average user will piratically never notice the difference unless a direct comparison is made, like i have done.

  • Cman21

    Hi10 vs 8bit comparisons and link that has a revised version of x264 that corrects the change in bit depth conversion algorithms for correct Hi10 output. all screenshots where taken from MPC using CoreAVC v3.0.1

    Gradient Comparisons:
    http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/80034

    Detail Comparisons:
    http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/80038
    http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/80039
    http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/80040
    http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/80041
    http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/80042

    x264 Hi10 color shifting Bug fix: http://x264.fushizen.eu/?p=381

    Screenshot Comparisons:
    http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/80048
    http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/80050

  • Anonim

    Re: Misconceptions about Hi10P and 10-bit output.
    As far as I understand, Hi10P doesn’t mean real 10-bit depth of colour but 2-bit data excess for better quality decoding. So you don’t need any especial video system. Am I correct?

    • nand

      Basically, yes – Hi10P means 2 bits of extra data for better quality /encoding/. If you know how video games work, it can sort of be compared to so-called “MSAA” or multi-sampling anti aliasing. They’re both techniques that use more data than you can display to get a smoother result.

      You do not need any special monitors or graphics cards or HDMI cables to view Hi10p because, just like MSAA, this gets rendered down to what your screen can handle as a last step before displaying.

  • Shaolan

    hi;
    i have some problem with mpc-hc + madVR guide : i have the incorrect osd at step three … so what should i do ?

    • nand

      During playback right click and browse to “Filters”, report the list here.

  • ondi

    On OSD, instead having “1 frame repeat every xx seconds”, I got “1 frame drop every xx seconds”. How can I fix this ?

  • Zet

    My setup with CoreAVC 3 doesn’t have results like the ones people have complained about.

    • Zet

      nevermind, came across a problem but it was only during an ad.

      • tormaid

        Only happens on high bitrate scenes. It’s been reported by multiple people to Corecodec so it’s only a matter of time till 3.1… hopefully, lol.

  • blankiee

    So is there a reason madVR crashes MPC-HC when I go into exclusive mode? I’ve tried reducing the scaling to bilinear and ticking some of the performance options to no avail. I’m running an i7-2630QM with nVidia GeForce GT525M and 4GB RAM if listing my specs helps.

  • tormaid

    Core AVC 3.0: http://img683.imageshack.us/img683/7264/faildwz.png

    Yeah, I’ll be sticking to FFDshow…

    • Zet

      Are you sure that’s not the video file itself and not CoreAVC 3?

      • nand

        Seems like it only happens on high-bitrate material. Still, quite funny.

        How’s performance compared to libav, though? That’s the most important thing right now, since we need a solution for poorfags.

        • Carnage

          The solution for both poor and richfags right now is LAV Video. :P For all the talk about “new assembly this and that” and whatnot, CoreAVC is blown out of the water by LAV Video for decoding speed of Hi10P content. And just as tradition, CoreAVC 3.0 shipped with tons of bugs. Besides, LAV Video’s constant updating is much better than once or less release a year of CoreAVC. I recommend not wasting your money or time on this garbage.

          On that note, you’d better update the LAVFilters link: http://lavfilters.googlecode.com/files/LAVFilters-0.34.exe

          Even FFDshow is seemingly faster than CoreAVC 3 for Hi10P content, but development of that has basically ceased. If you need even faster 10 bit decoding, your only option seems to be waiting for DiAVC.

  • ?

    CoreAVC 3.0 is now live!

    CoreAVC H.264 Video Codec – Version 3.0.0.0 (20110906)
    - ADD: 9 bit support
    - ADD: 10 bit support
    - ADD: DXVA fallback to software
    - ADD: Intel Media SDK Support (DXVA2)
    - ADD: Intel GMA Support (DXVA2)
    - ADD: 10 bit output format (P010)
    - ADD: 16 bit output format (P016)
    - ADD: Directshow dithering when filter output is downsampled
    - ADD: Improved DXVA handling for interlaced streams
    - ADD: Colorspace conversion from 10 bit formats to 8 bit formats
    - ADD: DXVA 2 Long slice support
    - ADD: Initial 4:4:4 integration (No decode support yet)
    - ADD: New assembly engine
    - ADD: New assembly IDCT
    - ADD: New assembly motion compensation
    - ADD: New assembly inter-prediction
    - ADD: New assembly weighted prediction
    - ADD: New assembly 9-bit
    - ADD: New assembly 10-bit
    - ADD: Improved assembly 8 bit performance
    - CHG: Use container AR when there is no stream AR
    - FIX: Improved Frame order handling
    - FIX: Hardware deinterlacing field order
    - CHG: DXVA increase max buffers
    - CHG: Sanitize sample stop times for buggy splitters, for hardware deinterlacing compatibility
    - FIX: Better recovery point handling, reduces artifacts for poorly cut streams
    - SDK: Updated xcode support for iOS and OS X
    - SDK: Improved APIs
    - SDK: Fix: Missing APIs
    - SDK: Initial support for MVC (CoreMVC) integration

    Haali Media Splitter – Version 1.11.233.7 (20110830)
    - FIX: Various DTS Audio bugs
    - ADD: Improved DTS support
    - ADD: Support for MVC 3D videos

  • Mark

    Can anyone help me please? For me, when selecting the renderer, madVR is greyed out and unclickable. I have followed all of the steps up until here so i don’t know why this is happening.
    I then tried to add madVR as external filter. This time, the video is good but the subtitles won’t appear, while they are enabled in both madVR and mpc-hc.

    • Carnage

      That means madVR wasn’t registered properly. This sometimes happens with Windows’ user access control. Regardless, subtitles should work even if you add madVR as preferred. Are you using the latest version of MPC-HC? The latest version is 1.5.3.3704.

      • nand

        He should be using the latest version of MPC-HC if he followed the guide.

        Also, are you sure subtitles will work if added as external filter? Doesn’t MPC-HC perform some significant hooking into the madVR renderer to upload subtitles to it?

        @Mark: Make sure you’re logged in as an Administrator when running install.bat. Do not right click and “run as admin”, log in as admin and run it normally.

        • Carnage

          Hmm I thought rev 3520 was a workaround for that but I guess I was wrong.

  • Something

    I would really appreciate help, Ive followed all the steps and gone through all the comments trying all the suggestions but for the love of god cannot stop this lag during playback. It also seems to overclock my CPU as well. As with other I’m a complete total noob at stuff like this. Ive always had problems playing anything over 1080p. Im sure its more of a performance issue.

    AMD Phenom(tm) II N620 Dual-Core Processor
    Memory (RAM) 4.00 GB
    AMD M880G with ATI Mobility Radeon HD 4250

    • ShadowVlican

      change your madVR scalers to bilinear.. your graphics card is much too weak for default settings

  • fesknet

    I can only say that with Nvidia Ion HTCP. That it wont work 10 bit
    My other main computer it works flawless but not with my htcp

    • ShadowVlican

      that’s what you get for building an HTPC with sub-par CPU specs… a strong CPU is much more future proof than graphics hardware decoding

  • Petrushka

    can someone help me? most of time, my karaoke keep flashing and blinking with madvr…..

    how can i fix it? well, actually it’s not a big problem for me. it just…

    • Petrushka

      for example

      http://www.nyaa.eu/?page=download&tid=239030

      OP translation + kara always blinking….

    • nand

      That’s because your PC is not powerful enough to render the subtitles, try:

      1. Increasing the sub-picture buffer size to compensate (work-around, will not always work)

      2. Decreasing the maximum subtitle resolution to something like 1280×720

      3. Disable animations in subtitles

      4. If all else fails, try the multi-threaded VSFilter instead of the ISR, which might increase performance slightly.

      • Petrushka

        looks like i’ve put too much pressure on my E5300 XD
        …..
        for point 4, where can i configure it?

        • Carnage

          I suggest disabling animation. Your CPU isn’t powerful enough to handle that, mostly because Hiryuu’s Dog Days 1080p Hi10P is severely bloated and the bitrate is too high for your CPU to handle. Personally I suggest using the 720p version instead.

          Regardless, if you want to try out the threaded VSFilter, it’s here: http://threaded-vsfilter.googlecode.com/files/VSFilter_STB4.zip

          Mind you, it’s still experimental and may not render subtitles as they were intended.

          • Petrushka

            maybe i’ll go with disable it or never mind with the blinking XD

            but thanks anyway…. i thought that with decent GPU ( ATi HD4650 1 GB ), i have no problem….. XD

          • nand

            The GPU only performs the post processing and rendering, the CPU is always used for decoding Hi10P material, *and* for rendering subtitles.

  • Nashaba

    Well, I can confirm that mplayer2 on Linux is not necesary if you have the latest FFMpeg installed. The latest snapshot of MPlayer – at least in Fedora – does not build against the system wide, shared FFMpeg, so it will work flawlessly with Hi10p files. Did I sound like a geek? :D

  • James Tiler

    I was just seeking this info for some time. After 6 hours of continuous Googleing, finally I got it in your website. I wonder what’s the Google’s issue that doesn’t rank this type of informative sites closer to the top. Generally the top websites are full of garbage.

  • Aznwesman

    hmm followed guide and now the 10bit anime that i have dont play anymore

    Any idea y?

    • asd

      3 options

      1- You messed up some how (because i followed the Guide and played it just fine)

      2- your PC is below 2GB ram, 128 graphics and 1.8GHz dual core

      3- MadVR does not support your grapphic and you should use MPlayer2

      I hope i helped

  • lippi

    Using 10bits from 8bits sources is like encoding 720p from a 480p source, complete useless

    • nand

      I am waiting for your multiple published papers endorsed by leading encoders from the community verifying this claim.

      • asd

        me too

    • Cman21

      no Hi10 isn’t useless. just looking at these screenshots that where posted above prove this: http://blisswater.info/comparison/elephantsdream/

      even if encoders changed nothing in their encoding settings minus Hi10 then you will see an increase in picture quality and about 5-10% file size reduction. but if you properly balance the increase in quality and file size you can increase the CRF by a point or 2 and maintain the same or slightly better quality than 8bit. this will also give you a smaller file size, ~15-20%.

      now some of you people with 10+TB systems who think file size doesn’t mean shit than just shut up and download the raw BD’s that are ~50GB per disc. encoders encode to reduce file size first and foremost and quality is second.

      now your 8bit source to 10bit does have some relevant points. you will not magically gain quality over the source video. but neither will 8bit encoding and 8bit doesnt have the advantages that 10bit has.

      So no it isnt useless unless you think encoding in general is useless.

  • Pingback: Dog Days BD 02 | Hiryuu Fansubs

  • http://www.r00nscape.com cig

    very helpful, thanks :]

  • phm

    Since my monitor is 8 bit anyway, why MadVr is better than using CCCP? And after all the original sourxes (blu ray) are 8 bit. I understand that by using 10bit encoding we can have better results in encoding, but since it won’t be real 10bit is the dithering thet CCCP does any problem?

    • nand

      There are three problems:

      1. The dithering filter that CCCP uses (swscale), has a levels bug, so you’ll wind up with slightly incorrect colors on a properly encoded Hi10P release.

      2. The more bits you work with, the less rounding errors you get during each step of processing. That’s why madVR uses 16-bit processing internally. If you dither down to 8-bit before rendering, it’s just going to get pulled up to 16-bit again, and all of the artifacts and noise you got while dithering to 8-bit is going to get distorted more and more.

      3. Dithering in RGB space is highly preferable to dithering in YUV space because YUV (generally) uses 4:2:0 subsampling so you have much less precision to work with for the colors. If you dither first and then upsample it, it might cause color mismatches / edge issues later on. That’s why it’s better to do all processing and upscaling first without touching the source, and then convert to RGB and dither down.

      • phm

        Thanks for the reply :P I guess i’m gonna have to try madVr myself, though some comparison screenshots would really be helpful for people to tell the difference.

  • zero

    Hey there, i’ve been trying to play Hi10p on my computer for a while, but i seem to have a hard time getting it to work, also my cpu goes crazy for some reason and starts to lag, i had really no trouble playing 10808p in 8bit before, my cpu would only get to around 20%-45% even with some really powerful videos, but with HI10p i cant even play it in 720p, im not sure if it’s my specs or if im doing something wrong

    my specs for my laptop are

    processer : Intel (R) Core (TM)2 Duo CPU T6600 @2.20GHz
    ram : 4GB
    video card : Mobile Intel (R)4 Express Chipset Family

    sorry im pretty much a nub when it come’s to this kind of stuff, i’ve been using potplayer but like i said my cpu starts to go crazy, i tried using MPC- Home Cinema with MadVR, but the video will sort of play sluggish, and also the problem with my cpu going around 80-100%

    i would really appreciate a response soon, so i could find out if it’s my specs, or if im doing something wrong

    • zero

      zero :
      Your comment is awaiting moderation.
      Hey there, i’ve been trying to play Hi10p on my computer for a while, but i seem to have a hard time getting it to work, also my cpu goes crazy for some reason and starts to lag, i had really no trouble playing 1080p in 8bit before, my cpu would only get to around 20%-45% even with some really powerful videos, but with HI10p i cant even play it in 720p, im not sure if it’s my specs or if im doing something wrong
      my specs for my laptop are
      processer : Intel (R) Core (TM)2 Duo CPU T6600 @2.20GHz
      ram : 4GB
      video card : Mobile Intel (R)4 Express Chipset Family
      sorry im pretty much a nub when it come’s to this kind of stuff, i’ve been using potplayer but like i said my cpu starts to go crazy, i tried using MPC- Home Cinema with MadVR, but the video will sort of play sluggish, and also the problem with my cpu going around 80-100%
      i would really appreciate a response soon, so i could find out if it’s my specs, or if im doing something wrong

    • zero

      sorry i meant 1080p, i mistyped it with 10808p lol

    • asd

      Your CPU should be able to handle Hi10P with no problem, my advice is that you check the processes running while you play the file and check if some “weird” process is consuming more CPU than it should, Ram is also more than enough if you are using Windows XP or Windows 7 or Linux or MAC OSX (idk about Vista :P ) finally about the GPU i have no idea about it.

      • zero

        thanks for the reply :) , well the only thing that seems to take up a lot of processsing is potplayer which takes up to 450k and about 50-100% of my cpu, everything else doesn’t take much up,when playing anime i always close every window i have open for that same reason, i’ve tried it on MPC-HC with cccp but it seems to take up even more power.

        is there someway i should set up potplayer so it doesn’t take that much power? Oh and about MPC-HC with madvr i managed to get it running together but it seems to be dropping a lot of frames? and again with the cpu?

        • asd

          Try using mplayer2 (mpalyer2 is Comannd line Interface only but using SMPlyer you can have a GUI), i forgot to say earlier but your CPU is better than the one i use to test stuff and could play 10bit 1080p using MPlayer2 and MPC-HC + CCCP sot its weird your CPU cant do it

    • nand

      Your GPU can’t run madVR, either drop madVR and use LAV Video + EVR Custom Presenter (or VMR-9), or try setting all of the scaling algorithms to “bilinear” and see if that helps performance.

      • zero

        alright i’ve tried the Lav Video+ EVR custom on MPC-HC it doesn’t lag anymore but the cpu varies in some scenes it could run at 45% but if there’s a big scene with a lot of effects it can go up to 100% gut it lowers back to around 50%

        and what are the steps to scale algorithms to “bilinear”? is this for potplayer or MPC-HC?

        sorry im pretty much a big nub when it comes to these things lol

        • zero

          Edit: i downloaded hiryuu dog days in hi10p in 1080p the opening lags a lot and the subtitles go on and off, i am going to try the 720p version. i’ll see if that one works better.

          • nand

            Try lowering the subtitle resolution from “Desktop” to something like 1280x720p if you’re having problems during subtitle playback.

            The “bilinear scalers” thing is just when using madVR, not EVR.

  • J-Man

    How do I place the subtitles in the bottom of the black bars? Do I use VSFilter, because I haven’t needed it before when just using MPC-HC+madVR.

    Also, I don’t get libav in Ctrl+J when playing an Xvid-movie, just YV12, 8 bit, 4:2:0. But when playing x264 or a DVD i get the correct result with libav as shown in the above screenshot.

    • nand

      VSFilter is incapable of placing subs outside the image,

      To do that you need to do this:

      1. In MPC-HC’s settings, go to “default style” and completely untick “position subtitles relative to the video frame”

      2. Under “screen alignment & margins”, decrease the “bottom” setting, to something like 5 or 10.

      3. (Optional) During video playback, use “pan & scan” (or Ctrl+Numpad8) to move the video up until it touches the top of the frame.

      Note that this comes at a price, bitmaps (eg. signs and such) will no longer align with the video frame.

      It’s your choice!

      Ps. That’s because the internal libav doesn’t decode Xvid, don’t mind it.

  • Red 009

    Is there a way to get the default MPC-HC seekbar with the various controls to show up? I kind of prefer to the bar-only one that this gives.

    • nand

      Simple.. don’t use exclusive mode.

    • Carnage

      You can untick the “show seek bar” box in the exclusive mode settings for that. Mind you, it will switch from exclusive to windowed mode for showing the seekbar in fullscreen, and back to exclusive when you remove your cursor from the bottom area.

      However, the switch can be disruptive as it’ll stall on the frame for a moment and you can miss subsequent frames. If you have a decently powerful system, you can, as nand said, switch off exclusive mode completely, without suffering any negative impact.

      It is, however, recommended to keep exclusive mode on if you face tearing. Exclusive mode also offers better performance than windowed mode, so it’s useful on slower machines/machines with less RAM.

      • nand

        I’ve always gotten better performance in windowed mode, strangely enough.

        And Aero handles vsync just fine, I think it’s really just there for non-Aero setups.

  • tormaid

    I’m getting dropped and delayed frames only when playing back 10-Bit content… No idea as to why (it’s not a hardware issue).

    • asd

      if you are using CCCP or k-lite codec pack or VLC dropped frames are “normal” you need to wait a bit more untill they correct that problem, i know i wasnt from much help but……

    • Carnage

      Dropped frames can be caused by any number of different issues. Unless you include additional information such as your CPU/GPU/RAM and which configuration you are using for playback, it is not possible for us to assist you.

      No, dropped frames are not necessarily “normal” with those. Most of the times these problems can be mitigated.

      • asd

        Carnage :
        No, dropped frames are not necessarily “normal” with those. Most of the times these problems can be mitigated.

        i know they can be mitigated but with week set up or weak CPU or GPU or few ram it is “normal” and not i put normal between “” ;)

    • ShadowVlican

      if you read my posts above, i also had drop frame issues ONLY with 10bit files… the culprit was my weak GPU… setting bilinear scaler in madVR solved it

      • ?

        Its bad 1 droped frame every 15 seconds? or 1 delayed frames?

        • Carnage

          Ideally you should have no dropped frames once your playback starts (there may be a few dropped frames before playback begins as it buffers up, but the “delay playback start until render queue is full” option should minimize that). As there are about 24 frames per second, one dropped frame every 15 seconds should not be noticeable.

          • ?

            Thanks!! work very nice with that option enable.

  • seifer

    Intel i7 920
    6GB DDR3 RAM
    nvidia geforce 470

    I only downloaded k-lite newest pack and works fine ;)

  • NAME

    That must be an issue with your OpenGL driver. It should work with reasonable up to date nvidia drivers.

    Using gradfun will make mplayer do the conversion 10 bit -> 8 bit in software with libswsscale, which throws the OpenGL driver out of the 10 bit pipeline.

  • Heracles

    With Hi10P, the main issue is much steeper hardware requirements.

    Adobe Flash, WMP, MPC-HC all use DXVA. DXVA allows CPU to idle while decoding high bitrate HD video. With Hi10P, there is no DXVA support.
    It is up to the CPU which is horribly inefficient.
    A good guide needs to focus more on performance!

    MadVR is not performance friendly as it focuses on QUALITY.
    With dev MPC-HC (see doom9 forum), EVR-CP and MPC-HC subtitle renderer are much more performance friendly.
    EVR-CP is a better choice. Also, don’t use V-Sync with Windows Aaero, they do the same thing!

    If even EVR-CP stutters, dead-last is Haali Renderer (I think you need to set YUY2 to use it!).

    For subtitle performance, uncheck “Allow animation when buffering” – this will significantly speed up subtitles at a cost of the kareoke effect.

    Also, go to OPTIONS -> PLAYER and check “Process Priority Above Normal”

    Also, it seems people do not understand what CUDA does.

    LAV CUVID and CoreAVC simply use CUDA to access NVIDIA’s hardware video decoding capabilities (PureVideo HD). DXVA does the same thing, but is limited to EVR renderers.
    It is not *REAL* CUDA. Real CUDA means re-writing ALL h264 decoding code for the NVIDIA GPU – which is an insane undertaking and probably won’t happen any time soon (CPU and GPU architecture is massively different). CUDA codecs right now simply use CUDA as a gateway to access the GPU’s video decoding chip (PureVideo HD) – and thus all the limitations that come with it.

    CoreAVC 3.0 thus will have CUDA in a sense of a “DXVA alternative for non-EVR renderers”, but NOT CUDA in a sense of a “complete re-written for NVIDIA GPU using CUDA decoder for various h264 material which by-passes purevideo HD limitations”.

    CoreAVC 3.0, at best, will have a faster than the competition CPU Hi10P h264 decoding capabilities and no CUDA for Hi10P.

    Hi10P may never be supported by GPU manufacturers.
    Consider the following,
    - Blu-Ray is 8-bit, YouTube is 8-bit, Netflix is 8-bit, etc
    - Banding issues can be fixed at playback with post-processing
    - Do people really notice and care about such things as above?
    - Banding issues can be fixed by upping the bitrate
    - ISP Speeds and Storage is getting faster and bigger.
    - Pirates are the primary consumer anyway
    - God forbid, but some are pushing for WebM – an inferior in all areas format to replace h264 (and thus Hi10P h264).

    • nand

      I think your perception is a bit flawed.

      1. You say DXVA is better than software rendering. DXVA uses the GPU to do all of its work,

      2. You then complain about madVR being too performance unfriendly. MadVR *also *does all its work on the GPU though.

      If you could play back DXVA before, you’ll be able to play back using madVR fine as well.

      If you don’t like madVR, don’t use it.

      Disabling animation is a non-solution, you may as well turn off subtitles completely.

      • Heracles

        1. Exactly. DXVA is better as it doesn’t tax the CPU. The GPU is designed for Graphics and Video in mind.

        In as much, an old single core desktop can play 1080p high-bitrate h264 with surround sound and 1080p animated subtitles with the help of a cheap NV 8 series or higher GPU. (Where it probably won’t handle medium bitrate 720p using the CPU alone)

        2.
        NVIDIA Purevideo HD is *not* dependent on GPU clock speeds.
        Shader/Core/RAM speeds do not matter for video decoding performance for NV GPUs (GPU generation does).

        On the other hand, shaders that MadVR uses do depend GPU power. MadVR can thus overtax the GPU and cause stuttering for h264 capable GPUs.

        Hell, Intel GPUs can play 16-ref frame high profile 1080p h264 – but can they handle a bunch of shaders?

        Subtitle animation only happens in the OP and ED as those tend to be music from one band or another.
        Toggling animation doesn’t do squat for the actual episode (with minor exceptions).
        It is fully livable without and does save CPU/GPU cycles.

        Do not let your opinions cloud your judgment.

        - Kareoke effects are not essential in any way.
        - MadVR is in no way essential to play Hi10P.

        Both of these are solutions for “maximum quality empiricism” and not “best playability now that DXVA cannot help you”.

        • nand

          If you’re running on a system so weak that it can’t play back Hi10P via software then you should either upgrade or watch 8-bit encodes. No way to dispute this.

          And like I said, if you don’t like madVR then don’t use it.

        • ShadowVlican

          while you say nVidia’s DXVA doesn’t depend on GPU clock speeds (and you’re probably right seeing that my lowly nVidia G105M can handle more DXVA encodes than my AMD 4290, which is faster) you’re forgetting about AMD/ATI users

          sadly nVidia has better DXVA support than AMD/ATI

          in the end, DXVA is flaky.. software decoding is not

  • nand

    ShadowVlican :

    interesting.. i set all my scaling algorithms to bilinear and the Hi10p’s from ANE no longer continuously drop frames!

    this is strange, because regular 8bit 1080P videos do not drop frames with Catmull-Rom for all 3 scalers

    i must wonder what exactly is MadVR scaling when playing 1080P video on a 1920×1200 screen… there should be nothing to scale, no?

    3.5GHz phenom X6 with AMD4290 IGP @ 900MHz

    Hmm, I can’t say for sure – maybe ask on the madVR thread? Chances are he scales regardless of output res (and it’ll just do a bunch of calculations that cancel eachother out if you do scale to the same resolution).

    Regardless, if you set it to bilinear then it should be fine for 1080p/720p, only really makes a difference for extreme upscaling.

    • Carnage

      Actually chroma is always subsampled in lossy compression and has to be upscaled. I think you’ll find just setting the chroma upscaler to Bilinear give a huge improvement, especially with 1080p content. Because people’s eyes are much less sensitive to chroma than luma, nobody should notice any difference in quality.

      madVR has some bad choices by making the default luma upscalers/downscalers horribly demanding algorithms like lanczos, which consumes huge processing power and does not give much benefit at all. For luma, Bicubic scalers and its variants (Mitchell, Catmull-Rom & softcubic) are more than accurate enough and have enough variations to suit people’s needs. Hell even Bilinear is fine for most people, that’s why I always recommend people to use that first.

      ShadowVlican’s and most other here’s problem is not related to weak CPU at all, it’s the GPU which can not keep up. A hexa-core Phenom is more than enough for Hi10P playback, the integrated GPU with default settings is not. I assume the added load for the Hi10P on the GPU derives from the additional dithering and higher precision of math required.

      • nand

        I see, that makes sense.

        I thought the chroma upsampling was done using the same algorithm regardless of what upscaling algorithm was used.

        Then I realized 4:2:0 was simply half resolution chroma information, so it just needs to get upscaled to twice the resolution, linearly.

      • ShadowVlican

        indeed the culprit was my weak GPU (AMD 4290 IGP) i’ve set my chroma scaler to bilinear and both my luma scalers to catmull-rom… no dropped frames as well!

        but i guess using bilinear is the fastest/safest.. they should make that the default

  • (~o_o)~

    Followed the guide. All I got to say is I Luv U.

    Finally figured out why it always lags when I play some BD’s and HI10p was just the same, only had to switch from low GPU performance to high. t.t

    It runs perfectly smooth now.

    *HP Pavilion dv6 Notebook PC (win7)
    *AMD Phenom(tm) II P650 Dual-Core Processor
    *ATI Mobility Radeon HD 6370

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      (づ ´・‿-)づ。。・゜゜・。。・゜❤

      • nand

        ( ´・‿  -) ~ ♥

  • kerem

    hi
    a perfect setting
    my problem dvd vob files notebook+pc
    mpcmp2codec+madvr =no problem
    madvrcodec+madvr=problem
    lavcodec+madvr=problem
    all codec+ evr=no problem
    problem =http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/853/ekrntsw.jpg/
    sorry my bad english good work thanks..

    • nand

      madVR doesn’t do de-interlacing so when watching LQ / SD content that is interlaced you will need to deinterlace it manually using, for example, ffdshow’s deinterlacing filter.

    • ShadowVlican

      if you primarily watch DVD video, use EVR-CP with microsoft’s dvd decoder or any other decoder that supports DXVA (your GPU to deinterlace/detelecine/etc… way better than any software based decoder)

  • ShadowVlican

    wow 10bit is hard to playback.. my 3.5GHz phenom x6 has dropped frames playing “[ANE] Ore no Imouto ga Konna ni Kawaii Wake ga Nai [BDRip 1080p x264 Hi10p FLAC]”

    8bit 1080p playback perfectly by following your guide MPC-HC+MadVR… but this 10bit release has tons of dropped frames (CTRL+J)

    i’ll blame inefficient 10bit decoder in MadVR.. for now

    • nand

      Sounds like you have other issues because my Core2Quad Q9550 plays it back fine even when it’s only at 3.4 GHz.

      In fact, I get decoding times of about 3-4 ms, compared to the 40 ms maximum before it will start stuttering / dropping frames.

      • ShadowVlican

        decoding times.. is that under “average stats: rendering” or “max stats: rendering” i’m gonna try figuring out what’s wrong with my system

        • nand

          iirc:
          Average stats rendering = decoding + transformation
          Average stats present = postprocessing etc. and displaying to screen

          • ShadowVlican

            interesting.. i set all my scaling algorithms to bilinear and the Hi10p’s from ANE no longer continuously drop frames!

            this is strange, because regular 8bit 1080P videos do not drop frames with Catmull-Rom for all 3 scalers

            i must wonder what exactly is MadVR scaling when playing 1080P video on a 1920×1200 screen… there should be nothing to scale, no?

            3.5GHz phenom X6 with AMD4290 IGP @ 900MHz

  • Wasuki

    Alright, here’s an update. Accessed the madVR settings, enabled what I had to. Then on playback I got the same message as someone from above:

    “madVR reports:
    -creating Direct3D device failed (8876086c)”

    However, my DirectX is v.11, which is up to date. So where do I adjust the GPU settings as you recommend above to the one who had similar issues?

    • nand

      Again, “Your GPU might not have enough video memory, try reducing the amount of backbuffers (rendering -> windowed mode settings) and disabling fullscreen exclusive mode (rendering -> general settings).”

      • Wasuki

        Yeah, I got that part. I’m just overwhelmed, I have no idea WHERE to access GPU “rendering” in the first place. MPC? Windows?

        I do apologize for my ignorance.

        • nand

          Backbuffer count is in madVR

          Rendering -> windowed mode settings or exclusive mode settings depending on which you use.

  • Wasuki

    Also, I have no idea how to get back into the madVR settings. I was able to access it yesterday but can’t remember how I got there in the first place. Nothing in my tray shows an icon for madVR or anything. I apologize for the stupid questions.

  • Ratatoskr

    Why can’t i enable Shader (Such as sharpen complex 2) with mpc-hc + madVR ?
    when i try to enable it, it just gives me “could not load shader”
    or is it always been like this?

    • nand

      Not sure, it might be due to the custom pipeline that madVR uses.

      I believe he’s thinking of adding postprocessing shader support (eg. sharpen) to the madVR pipeline.

  • Wasuki

    Carnage :
    I see nand has omitted this, but I recommend adding Haali Media Splitter to the filter list and set it to prefer. Check if you set the Decoders in madVR again properly.
    If it still doesn’t work, add the Microsoft DTV-DVD Video Decoder to the list and set it to Block and see if it works. But it kinda seems like your madVR didn’t get installed properly.
    Also an explanation of what you mean by MPC+CCCP and VLC are not working would be helpful.

    Well, I upgraded from XP to 7 when my computer had some files beyond repair. My friend did it for me, so I don’t know the exact specifics, and I’m only computer savy enough to explain everything in basic newb talk.

    But my VLC was pixelated in grainy in 7, something it wasn’t in XP. I messed with the output changing to DirectX and OpenGL and nothing changed. So using this opportunity to move onto a new player, I downloaded CCCP+MPC. It plays fine visual wise compared to VLC, but it ended up backwards and upside down.

    I’ll try your suggestion though. Thanks. Perhaps you could figure out what I can do to fix the other problems?

    • Carnage

      Odd. Which GPU are you using? Try updating your graphics card’s drivers from the manufacturer’s website.

  • B

    B :
    cpu : core i5 2.40ghz
    ram : 4gb ddr3
    Video card : intel HD 3000 + nvidia 525m
    Win 7 Home premium 64bit …
    I think i was able to play .flv without a problem O.O … lol

    and by the way .. I tried playing a h 10bit video and it displays correctly but MPC- HC uses more than 1GB of RAM and CPU usage between 75-85% … and after a second or 2 of very sluggish video playing my MPC -HC crashes …
    the video is .mkv .

    • nand

      Try reducing the buffer size?

  • B

    cpu : core i5 2.40ghz
    ram : 4gb ddr3
    Video card : intel HD 3000 + nvidia 525m
    Win 7 Home premium 64bit …
    I think i was able to play .flv without a problem O.O … lol

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  • memekontol

    ffdshow RGB32 output play hi10p give high cpu usage
    it’s fucking ffdshow BUG

    after uncheck RGB32
    i can playback hi10p with low cpu usage

  • Wasuki

    I goofed somewhere. I followed everything including adding madVR as the preferred filter and got:

    The following pin(s) could not find a connectable filter:

    Video
    Microsoft DTV-DVD Video Decoder::Video Output 1

    —

    So now what? I got Windows 7, using this as a longshot seeing MPC+CCCP and VLC aren’t working.

    • Carnage

      I see nand has omitted this, but I recommend adding Haali Media Splitter to the filter list and set it to prefer. Check if you set the Decoders in madVR again properly.

      If it still doesn’t work, add the Microsoft DTV-DVD Video Decoder to the list and set it to Block and see if it works. But it kinda seems like your madVR didn’t get installed properly.

      Also an explanation of what you mean by MPC+CCCP and VLC are not working would be helpful.

      • nand

        I’ve never needed to set Haali as prefer since it’s pretty much always the preferred splitter, at least it should be on a clean install – as long as you disable the internal ones.

  • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

    Carnage :

    B :
    Thank you for this guide … well I have done every thing was written in this guide .. but I get a very very choppy and slow video playback I tried .mkv and .mp4 .. all the same …

    As I said for sanachama up above, set all the scaling algorithms to Bilinear, and set the flush settings to “Flush, Flush, Don’t Flush, Don’t Flush”. Disable Calibration and Gamma Processing. See if that helps.

    Also stating computer specs could help a bit, so we know what we are working with.

  • B

    Thank you for this guide … well I have done every thing was written in this guide .. but I get a very very choppy and slow video playback I tried .mkv and .mp4 .. all the same …

    • Carnage

      B :
      Thank you for this guide … well I have done every thing was written in this guide .. but I get a very very choppy and slow video playback I tried .mkv and .mp4 .. all the same …

      As I said for sanachama up above, set all the scaling algorithms to Bilinear, and set the flush settings to “Flush, Flush, Don’t Flush, Don’t Flush”. Disable Calibration and Gamma Processing. See if that helps.

      • nand

        Don’t forget to enable the performance tweaks of madVR as well, they can make a difference.

        If your subtitles are causing the choppiness, try increasing the buffer size or using threaded VSFilter.

        • Carnage

          Actually I would recommend that you use the performance tweaks as a last resort. You lose virtually nothing in terms of picture quality by switching to Bilinear but the speedup is huge, and in most cases should let you get smooth playback (I can even view 720p with a crappy Intel integrated GPU). But turning off dithering can have a noticeable drop in quality, and at least on my GPU, the performance tweak options do not actually seem to make a huge difference in load.

          So I suggest switching to Bilinear first, if that still gives choppy playback, go for the options on performance tweaks.

          Also, as Swaps4 said, posting your PC config would help.

  • http://underwater.nyaatorrents.org Daiz

    >Do NOT use VSFilter (aka DirectVobSub) with Hi10P material! It destroys the image quality

    What in the hell makes you say this? Using external VSFilter does not ruin anything any more than using MPC-HC’s internal VSFilter does.

    Also, how does CCCP have “shit” performance compared to the others? All the free decoders out there use libavcodec for decoding.

    Also, CCCP dithering the 10-bit video to 8-bit has practically zero effect unless you own one of those fancy-pants 10-bit displays (and as the guide states, one most likely doesn’t).

    • nand

      Well, we’ve already spoken but I’m reposting this here:

      VSFilter forces dithering before sub rendering, which has a few problems:

      1. Additional quantization noise because when madVR pulls it back up to 16-bit and applies a shitton of transformations, the reduced accuracy results in an imperfect result due to rounding errors accumulating exponentially.

      2. CCCP (ffdshow) and LAV Video use swscale to dither which has a levels bug (so does x264 unless it’s been patched already), whereas madVR uses the “correct” algorithm for all dithering. If your source is properly encoded this could cause color inaccuracies when using VSFilter.

      3. More minor but VSFilter subtitles are obviously going to be blurry at lower resolutions because they’re rendered at a smaller size.

      And CCCP has shit performance because it’s outdated as hell most of the time, plus ffdshow including a slow 8 bit software pipeline, which is completely unnecessary for simple playback. It also uses an outdated single threaded VSFilter which has poorer performance than the modern multi-threaded ones.

    • Carnage

      Daiz :
      Also, how does CCCP have “shit” performance compared to the others? All the free decoders out there use libavcodec for decoding.

      On a pure decoding chain on my machine, playing Commie’s Steins;Gate Hi10P OP, LAV Video is 12.5% faster than latest FFDshow (117 vs 104 FPS) with YV12 output. Not exactly dramatic but significant. Planar 10 bit output to madVR should be faster. FFDshow’s RGB32 output performance is atrocious.

      BTW, nand, LAV Filters 0.32 has been released. You should update your links with the installer: http://files.1f0.de/lavf/LAVFilters-0.32.exe

      • nand

        Done.

  • Concerned Anon

    You really shouldn’t be using that LoGH comparison picture, since it’s a fake.

    • nand

      Removed it since this has been the second report.

  • Garylisk

    Can’t get it working no matter what I try. I have uninstalled MPC 64 bit, installed 32 bit, installed Haali, followed the setup instructions precisely all the way up to the part where you select madVR from the Output list, and it is grayed out.

    Note, I had to add it as an external filter manually – madVR’s install.bat does not work for me. It says “Registering the DirectShow filter madVR.ax failed.” every time. So anyway, I added it manually to MPC, and it’s in the list, but it’s grayed out. I’ve tried uninstalling everything and starting from scratch, making sure I was using the 32 bit version of MPC-HC, and it’s a no go. What the heck, eh?

    • nand

      Ask on madVR’s forums why registering the DirectShow filter failed.

      Note: If it’s grayed out, that means MPC-HC does not recognize it – it’s grayed out even if you don’t have it installed at all. That doesn’t tell you anything significant.

      What version of Windows are you using? If it’s Vista or 7, make sure you’re logged in as an Administrator, and try temporarily disabling UAC, installing it, then re-enabling.

      • Garylisk

        The problem has been solved. This is a matter of not being logged in as an admin. I was able to do everything easily when I changed my account type to an administrator. The guide here says to not run the install.bat as an administrator, but instead “run it normally and click “accept”" – but it never asks you, it just fails, and when run as an admin, it just blinks and nothing happens.
        So anyway, I am not sure if madVR’s install method is at fault, or Windows 7′s anal security, but either way, so far as I can tell, you should be able to set your main account to admin, install, and then set it back to a normal user (Which is really recommended, seriously.) once it’s done.

  • Brad

    CAN DXVA eventually be updated to work with hi10 or will a whole new GPU acceleration method need to be made?

    Will current DXVA GPUs be able to do it if they do or is a hardware update needed

    • nand

      We will have to wait for the new graphics drivers from AMD and nVidia to support it.

      And after that, maybe even Microsoft to update the API.

      It will presumably not require a change in graphics hardware because current graphics cards are more than easily capable of 16-bit or 32-bit textures internally.

  • ShadowVlican

    great guide and write up!

  • Witcher

    ok, l will try it, thanks for the reply <3

  • Witcher

    hey nand-chan, you use the defaults algorithms settings (chroma soft100 and luma lancsos 4tap) or you use another algorithms??

    l have a Dell UltraSharp U2311H already calibrate, the colours looks gorgeous, but l dont know what settings is the best for great quality

    l have a GTX 570 and use madvr internal decoders(i5-2500k) all runs perfect.

    sorry for bad english btw.

    • nand

      I use spline 4-taps for both. There’s really no way to say that except to try it out yourself.

  • D2M

    Hi, I have a question. I have a ASUS EEE PC 1215T,
    It using an AMD ATHLON NEO K 1.7 GHZ, 2Gig of RAM, for the GPU is an ATI HD RADEON 4250. Right now i’m using the newest CCCP,
    And it can play all the H.264 8 Bit, but if play the 10bit, sometimes there is a lag between the picture and the sound.Can you help me? So it can also play the 10bit smoothly? I compare is using M*ya Ch*iki Eps4 (8bit) and Eps5 (10bit).

    • nand

      Probably can’t. You should wait until CoreAVC 3 is out and try that, it might be able to play back 10 bit smoothly.

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  • sanachama

    Wow, after seeing hi10p I really can’t go back anymore.
    But, my video tends to go quite slow, there’s lag. I was wondering if that’s something that could be possibly fixed with other settings, or something?

    Also, with 10p and even 8p sound can be a bit choppy sometimes, some kind of sound lag. I’ve never had similar lag before, and I’ve hardly used MPC-HC so I’m not sure what to do about it.

    If you need any of my specs, I’ll gladly post them, sorry for the trouble. I don’t know much about filters at all.

    • nand

      What sorts of rendering times / presentation times do you get during Hi10P playback?

      First step to rectifying the problem would be identifying which of the two takes the highest workload.

      What CPU/GPU do you have?

      • sanachama

        Hey, I believe this is where the rendering/presentation could be seen. took it about 40 seconds in to the video. it’s kind of unstable.

        http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/4894/renderings.png

        my processor is a Pentium Dual-Core. T4200. 2.00GHz.

        I hope that’s right.

        • nand

          Oh my.. oh my oh my

          Try going into the performance tweaks section of madVR and enabling everything.

          If that doesn’t help, then I think your only option is to wait until CoreAVC supports Hi10P and use its hardware accelerated decoder..

        • Carnage

          Set all the scaling algorithms to Bilinear, and set the flush settings to “Flush, Flush, Don’t Flush, Don’t Flush”. Disable Calibration and Gamma Processing. See if that helps.

          • sanachama

            Thanks guys, it definitely runs a lot smoother now, I don’t notice any lag ^^

  • http://fate.jp jun

    correction…

    what do I do now to play hi10p movie?
    though it play well when I’m not using madVR, but still there’s picture on the video being rainbow.. :(

  • jun

    I keep getting error below..
    madVR reports:
    -creating Direct3D device failed (8876086c)

    I’ve following your guide throughly..
    and like the comment before, uninstall and install directx (9c/10/11)
    I’m using windows xp sp 3

    what do I do now to play hi10p movie?
    though it play well when I’m using madVR, but still there’s picture on the video being rainbow.. :(

    • nand

      Taken from a reply on the madVR forums:

      Your GPU might not have enough video memory, try reducing the amount of backbuffers to 1 (rendering -> windowed mode settings) and disabling fullscreen exclusive mode (rendering -> general settings).

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  • Whatever

    Stupid question. Is there a way to make my .mkv files have the MPC-HC type icon like it did when using CCCP?

    • Whatever

      forgot to mention i did the MPC-HC + madVR installation

    • nand

      MPC-HC options menu,

      Players -> Formats -> Turn on “With icons” and click “Video”.

      • Whatever

        thanks a bunch

  • Nick

    Video: DivX 5 608×336 25.00fps [Video]
    Audio: MPEG Audio Layer 3 44100Hz stereo 112kbps [Audio]

    • nand

      Well, enable just the internal filter for “DivX” and see if that helps.

      • Nick

        Actually, it did. Thanks.

  • Nick

    I’m having a problem with MPC-HC crashing on the file playing of .avi, using Haali, madVR and ffdshow according to the guide settings.

    When I turn on all my transform filters, except for the filters disabled for madVR, I do not have this problem.

    Anyone got a solution for this?

    • nand

      Identify what media type the video inside the .avi file is (right click -> properties during playback).

      It may be that the ffmpeg decoder for that media type is somehow broken.

      Post here when you find out what the video is encoded as.

  • Carnage

    The MPC-HC_r3627_x86.7z file is 7-zip compressed archive of the standalone MPC-HC program and its language files. MPC-HC_standalone_filters_r3627_x86.7z contains the standalone versions of the decoder and splitter filters that comes built-in with MPC-HC (you don’t need this). MPC-HomeCinema.1.5.3.3627.x86.exe is an installer.

    • nand

      The installer is identical to the .7z file?

      • Carnage

        Yes, it is the same version.

  • Carnage

    Sourceforge’s MPC-HC builds are way outdated. You’re missing out on vital fixes and improvements by using those. You can get the latest MPC-HC from here: http://xhmikosr.1f0.de/

    • nand

      Do you know what the difference between the three versions are?

      Namely MPC-HC_r3627_x86.7z, MPC-HC_standalone_filters_r3627_x86.7z and MPC-HomeCinema.1.5.3.3627.x86.exe.

    • Petrushka

      thanks bro….

      now it works!

      :D

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  • Petrushka

    looks like i have same problem like pmc………..

    MPC didn’t want to show subtitle whenever i add madvr as “Prefer”

    this is what i get if i add madvr as “Prefer”

    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-rzeglbwn5G8/TkHBTFWyOlI/AAAAAAAAAAY/3uwSRqb_qaA/s1600/prefer.jpg

    subtitle show again after i delete it, but it’s h264 now, not libav

    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-15_9eRv7nsQ/TkHBDTEdGiI/AAAAAAAAAAU/mZZ-vhs1KjI/s1600/no_filter.jpg

    sorry that i can’t take SS with option, but believe me that i have deleted madvr external filter in the 2nd screenshot

    can u help me?

    • nand

      For the reference, the second screenshot is using ffdshow to decode and it also demonstrates how output is dithered down to 8 bit (“-> YV12, 8 bit, 4:2:0”).

      I just tested it and that is indeed very strange. Subs work fine if I use madVR without it being set to prefer, but they don’t work if I set madVR to prefer here as well. I’ll report it on the madVR thread.

      Here are two methods you could try to work around the issue:

      1. Open up ffdshow’s settings and set its DirectShow merit to “normal” or lower (as seen at the bottom of the guide or http://haruhichan.com/img/Guides/merit.png )

      2. If you don’t mind not having ffdshow, add “ffdshow video decoder” and set it to “Block”. This should be helpful at least for debugging.

      Also, remove “madVR” as prefer.

      Edit: I made some progress on tracking down the cause of this issue.

      When setting madVR to prefer, the Filters menu lists “madVR” – when letting MPC-HC pick it automatically, it reports “madVR Renderer” – madVR is performing the decoding in both cases.

    • nand

      A response in the board:

      “madshi fixed that issue. You need to get a more recent version of MPC-HC. ”

      Edit: build 3520 to be exact

      • Petrushka

        >Edit: build 3520 to be exact

        so looks like i have to wait until it release because afaik the newest one is MPC – HC 32bit (x86) v1.5.2.3456

        • nand

          Yeah, or just work around the issue by not adding madVR as prefer (but ensuring no other filter takes its place)

  • starport

    PLEASE… Please add the minimum hardware support/capable of running this new encodes- like cpu , video card and memory. THANKS!

    • nand

      I don’t really know anything about that since it really depends on too many factors, plus I don’t have any low-end machines to test it on.

  • kamineko

    It would be worth pointing out that you need to run the install.bat from madVR *without* privileges and wait for the prompt to elevate rights.

    If you are proactive and let it “run as admin”, it seems to work, but doesn’t really (madVR stays greyed out).

    Took me more than one hour and numerous re-installs to find the cause.

  • kotobroski

    I keep getting this error whenever I try to playback a file with MPC-HC and madVR:

    “madVR reports:
    -creating Direct3D device failed (8876086c)”

    I have absolutely no idea what’s causing this. Everywhere else I look said it was a problem madVR had with potplayer or other players, but NOT MPC-HC, which I’m using. After double-checking, I can confirm I’m using the 32-bit version and that all of my settings match your directions exactly. I’m completely bewildered.

    • nand

      8876086c is a D3DERR_INVALIDCALL.

      Uninstall all versions of DirectX you have (9.0c, 10, 11) completely and reinstall them.

      You must be having some outdated version or mismatched DLL somewhere.

      • kotobroski

        …Uninstall DirectX? Unless I’m mistaken, isn’t that an integral part of Windows? How do I uninstall it?

        Would simply updating it potentially fix the problem?

        • nand

          Hmm, I forgot about that, DirectX won’t let you uninstall it – see if you can update it to fix the problem or something. Might also some hotfixes in the windows updater.

  • Anonymous

    The latest git build of mplayer2 in Ubuntu, and most likely other Linuxes, doesn’t render Hi10P properly. It should be run with -vf gradfun (or vf=gradfun in .mplayer/config) to enable dithering.

    • nand

      Can you confirm this behavior under Windows as well?

      I don’t have a decent test file in which banding would become obvious.

      • Anonymous

        It’s not banding, it’s just that mplayer2 tries to open a 10-bit gl device. As the result the video looks almost monochrome, with some color spots in between.
        http://imageshack.us/f/703/nutbladdermawarupenguinx.png/
        I’m not even sure it’s an mplayer2 issue.

        • nand

          Sounds more like an issue with the GL renderer then. It might be related to your graphics driver at a root level, since it might report an incompatible display mode as compatible.

          Here, at least, GL knows I don’t have any 10-bit deep display modes available (unless I do), and uses the 8 bit output mode automatically.

          Have you tried forcing the output to 8 bit using -vf format?

          • Anonymous

            -vf format,scale works as well. Didn’t compare the picture with -vf gradfun, they look the same though.

  • Cman21

    http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/66312

    please dont lie to us! the 10bit is obviously filtered in the example above. if you look at the guy on the far right you’ll see that in the dark part of his suit the black lines on his vest disappear. you can also see the lines on the top right, where the lights are, they too disappear! this is obviously from filtering.

    please remove this from your guide as it is misleading.

    part in question: (“there are plenty” link)

    “There are plenty of picture comparisons available too. Remember to keep in mind that it isn’t 100% perfect yet and encoders are working hard to get the right settings.”

    • nand

      But I still see the lines. Maybe you should get a better monitor?

      • Cman21

        ok… yes you can still “see” the lines but you cant say that whoever made that comparison didnt use a smoothing/degraining filter on the 10bit image vs 8bit. practically all the film grain is gone and the 2 black lines on the top right are “practically” smoothed away completely, to the point at a glance one wouldn’t notice them. could you at least say where this came from or what the movie/show is? as i am really eager to try this out myself as i just can not see that being a true comparison between 8 and 10 bit encoding without there being some filtering hiding in the background.

      • Stsin

        Defending that it is not filtered? It’s obviously so. It’s the crosslines in the lower shadows of that suit that all but disappear, not around the neck. What was removed was not due to banding.

        While Hi10 requires less bitrate to reduce banding, you still have to be concerned about the rest when raising the CRF. Like during fast motion scenes, lowering the bitrate may give the same nice static background, but the parts that are in motion may become bitrate starved.

        Since there’s no question that HI10 reduces banding, action scenes would be better for comparing quality when using different CRFs.

        • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

          These are just comparison pictures, there is no need to argue over it. I fully understand that, that image is filtered but there isn’t many Hi10P comparison pictures out at the moment due to everyone is still messing with it. If you want me to get rid of that picture that bad, I will do. If you have any better pictures to add to that to help out, feel free to drop the links.

          • Cman21

            i only want it removed because it is an unfair comparison that is heavily weighted on Hi10. Hi10 alone can not produce those kind of results, which is why i think it is misleading.

  • TSR

    “How NOT to play back Hi10P content:
    ZoomPlayer,”

    Sorry but this is just plain wrong, at least very misleading. You can set ZP to render Hi10P properly the same way you set MPCHC. It’s just a matter of setting the split-decode-render chain properly.

    • nand

      Good catch! I took the list of unsupported players from the original post before my edits, seems I missed that detail.

      Maybe he included ZoomPlayer to the list of unrecommended players for another reason? (bad subs, outdated, etc)

      Regardless, edited it out for now.

    • budda

      how do you get zoomplayer to render 10bit correctly and what to install?

      • nand

        I don’t know, I don’t use ZoomPlayer.

      • NobleScarlet

        Using Zoom Player for Hi10p is pretty easy. Just download the CCCP latest version, then install ONLY ffdshow and Haali Media Splitter from CCCP, then that’s it! Just make sure that you use Haali as the video renderer. And I suggest using version 7 instead of 8. ^^

  • piecemealcranky

    I can probably vouch that in your case, with madVR as output, 1080p will play with stutters and sometimes take too long for the video to load. I have a Compaq 6-year old lappy (designed for Windows XP, but bleh, I formatted to Win7), 1GB in RAM, Centrino Duo and it can’t play most 1080p files. At high demanding bitrate scenes the player attempts to keep up with audio synchronising, and as a result freezes and jumps ahead to 5 or 6 seconds in time to keep up. I would stick with DXVA for now and upgrade later whenever they support Hi10.

    • nand

      Have you considered enabling some of the “performance hacks” in madVR’s settings?

      Also, what’s CoreAVC performance like?

      • piecemealcranky

        Have yet to try this on my lappy. Won’t be doing so anytime soon though, I gave up 1080p playback on it a while ago. ;_;

  • samthegreat

    Sup, my PC is kinda slow, so I was using CCCP and CoreAVC up until now with great results. Basically, I couldn’t play 1080p at all before (serious lags, was unwatchable). If I change to madVR and follow all the steps, do you think it will affect the overall performance? Hope it’s clear enough. Thanks in advance.

    • http://haruhichan.com seidweise

      Can you tell us your PC specs in order to get a definite answer?

      • samthegreat

        It’s a Intel Pentium 4 3.0 GHz with 1Gb of RAM. Video card is NVIDIA GeForce 8500 GT. I might try libav but I might end up using CoreAVC 3. Hopefully it’ll come out before the Fall 2011 season.

        • nand

          By the way, you can use CoreAVC without CCCP. You can even use CoreAVC with madVR (not sure if this works well with DXVA/CUDA though).

          Just follow the guide, but instead of selecting madVR’s internal decoders, slap on CoreAVC and have it configure itself.

    • nand

      CoreAVC will probably still be faster than libav but you’ll have to wait until version 3 for it to support Hi10P.

      If you have a GPU capable of decoding video (CUDA v3/4, DXVA, etc.) you should be using that (but it won’t work with Hi10P)

      Other than that you’ll have to try it and figure out. Can’t offer any guarantees.

      • samthegreat

        Alright thanks.

  • redshoulder

    Followed the step above and worked perfect, then installed ffdshow as above and the other steps aswell for older content such as xvid and now mpc crashes most of the time when it does work it is laggy and no subtitles i get this,

    Problem Event Name: BEX
    Application Name: mpc-hc.exe
    Application Version: 1.5.2.3456
    Application Timestamp: 4e29d332
    Fault Module Name: madVR.ax_unloaded
    Fault Module Version: 0.0.0.0
    Fault Module Timestamp: 4e370f82
    Exception Offset: 4a404448
    Exception Code: c0000005
    Exception Data: 00000008
    OS Version: 6.1.7601.2.1.0.256.48
    Locale ID: 6153
    Additional Information 1: 0a9e
    Additional Information 2: 0a9e372d3b4ad19135b953a78882e789
    Additional Information 3: 0a9e
    Additional Information 4: 0a9e372d3b4ad19135b953a78882e789

  • nand

    piecemealcranky :

    Okay works fine now. I dunno what I did, but subs are working again.

    Maybe you forgot to properly restart MPC-HC after applying changes? Or maybe Haali wasn’t chosen as media splitter.

    Either way, when followed from scratch, this guide should result in working subs. If it doesn’t then it’s likely that either a previous setup is affecting it or some minor detail / step was forgotten.

    • pmc

      Perhaps, but it is most likely something else in the system was messing with it. Got CCCPi running and figured out some filters and codecs that might be taking over once things were removed from my system. Pretty okay now though.

      • pmc

        Okay, figured out the cause. madVR must not be added as a preferred external filter upon installation, at least in my case. Here are some screens. External softsubs will disappear if otherwise.

        With madVR set to “prefer”:
        http://i55.tinypic.com/2vbls76.jpg

        Without (completely removed):
        http://i51.tinypic.com/nz553l.jpg

        Figured this was harmless.

        P.S. Any way to render a test of outputs on MPC-HC? Just to see realtime on what filters are used for audio and video tracks.

        • nand

          Right click MPC-HC during playback and there should be a “Filters” menu, which shows a list of all loaded filters, from bottom to top being first to last in playback order.

          Check the OSD (Ctrl+J) during playback while you have subtitles loaded and check to see that it’s actually showing “libav” as decoder.

          Adding madVR as prefer should *not* make subtitles disappear, at least not on my setup.

          Ps. ef was brilliant, good sir

          • pmc

            Then that is pretty odd. Nevertheless it works unless I install a different codec package but for the meantime madVR does the trick.

            I don’t remember about filters since the classic MPC I used years ago. This seems pretty handy, thanks.

            And ef was awesome, I think it was Shaft’s only good animation (besides Madoka but that is entirely merited by Nitro+ IMO). I hated Zetsubou Sensei past the 2nd season and Arakawa was so-so. Good thing they didn’t decide to ditch their close up mug-shot style of animation halfway.

          • Stef

            It seems it’s MPC-HC bug. I struggled with making subtitles work with madVR but I never imagined the solution would be so silly.

  • Anon

    Great guide, works perfect!

  • Akagi

    MadVR doesn’t load from Playback > Output. I have to manually add the filter, and then MPC-HC will use it.

    Problem is, when it does use it none of the subtitles show up. If I manually try to load subs, it says I have to change the video renderer type.

    • Akagi

      Fixed it.

      Turns out I just had to download the latest version of madVR and not the one linked to.

      • nand

        Which one did you download then? The link always points to the latest version, currently 0.73.

    • Petrushka

      new problem comes out. now mine show libav, but instead, now it doesn’t load any subtitle. i have checked auto-load subtitle, but it doesn’t work.

      when i try to Navigate -> Subtitle language and enable it, it doesn’t work too….

      damn….what’s wrong with mine? i had downloaded the latest version of madvr, haali, mpc-hc, ffdshow, madflac ( although it’s not connected)….

      • nand

        Make sure Haali Media Splitter is being used (double check that you have the internal filters for Matroska source files, or whatever files you have, *deselected*)

        Also, make sure you don’t have “Ignore embedded subtitles” turned on or anything, under Subtitles -> Misc.

        If that still doesn’t work, confirm that the subtitles are working in other media players (like mplayer2 or when using CCCP) and I’ll get back to you.

        • piecemealcranky

          Having the same problem, all from fresh downloads, subtitles not appearing even in 10-bit encoded vids. Seems like something’s wrong here…

          • piecemealcranky

            Okay works fine now. I dunno what I did, but subs are working again.

          • NoiseAnnoyz

            I have this same problem

  • Ani

    Hi,
    I followed this guide and I can view Hi10P videos without any problems now. But now I can’t make screenshots with MPC-HC anymore.
    Did I have to change some settings or did you just can’t make screenshots with MPC-HC + madVR? And if it is like this how can you make screenshots from Hi10P videos?

    • Carnage

      You just can’t make screenshots with MPC-HC + madVR. using MPC-HC’s Save Image function. You can however pause the video, press the Print Screen button from your keyboard and paste it in a image editor (like MS Paint or whatever) or use a dedicated screen capture tool, or if you have Windows 7, it comes with a program called Snipping Tool. You can use that too.

    • nand

      Do you have madVR’s exclusive mode turned on? If so, turn that off.

      I use Alt + PrintScreen in fullscreen to take screenshots and it works fine.

      • Zet

        How do you know if it’s turned on?

        Also it seems like a big downside not being able to use File > Save Image.

        • nand

          Just use some automated screen capture tool if you need it bound to a hotkey, other than that there’s no real difference.

          • the trooper

            I think there’s a difference: if you take a screenshot using mpc-hc you get a image of the actual resolution of the file (so if you take a shot of a 1080p video in a 1050p monitor you get a 1080p shot), while if you use alt+PS you get the resolution of the monitor (always 1050p, no matter what the original resolution is, if it’s in fullscreen on a 1050p monitor) and the annoying black borders.

            Please correct me if i’m wrong

          • Zet

            I just found an easier way. Once you find what you want to take a picture of, just press 1(this removes the player interface, so once you’re done just press 3 to return to normal) and then alt+prnt screen.

          • http://nyaa.eu wat

            Or just use ffdshow’s grab function

  • Zet

    Once CoreAVC 3 is released, should I use that instead of the Haali’s media splitter mentioned in the guide?

    • Zet

      Also would it be fine to keep CCCP installed and just add madVR? or should I just follow the guide word by word?

      • nand

        If you know what you’re doing you can just add madVR on top of CCCP, it isn’t really necessary to follow the guide from scratch – I wrote it that way to prevent all of the “bla bla but I had this and that setup and put this on top but etc. etc” comments.

        Basically all you need to do is make sure madVR does the decoding – whenever something isn’t right, you can bend it to your will by blocking the offensive filter or preferring the one you want (in the external filters menu).

        If you have nothing else selected, then madVR should use its internal decoders by default, though – just give it a shot and see what the OSD reports.

      • Carnage

        Uh, the guide text here can be misleading. The player that comes with CCCP is just the plain vanilla version of MPC-HC. The only different thing is FFDshow which was tweaked to add 10bit H.264 support.

        Use CCCP if you need the other filters that come with it, but if you intend to use madVR then I highly recommend you use madVR’s decoder for H.264 than CCCP’s FFDshow. FFDshow currently sucks for 10 bit decoding.

        Currently the only way to add “post-processing” is through FFDshow. You can either use FFDshow’s own decoder to use LAV Video for 10 bit and then feed the data to FFDshow but they’ll both result in drop of performance and quality due to dithering down.

        CoreAVC doesn’t have any splitter on its own, it just packs Haali’s splitter with its installer. They they are same. Haali’s splitter will get updated on his website once CoreAVC 3 is released. Haali’s is the best splitter for MKVs as it is the only one which can use Ordered Chapters/Editions used in some animes (Chihiro/CoalGirls/Doki), so no reason to use any other splitter for MKVs, at least.

        Remember, your best setup for 10 bit h.264 is: MPC-HC + Haali’s splitter + madVR/LAV Video decoder + madVR renderer.

    • nand

      I don’t know how good CoreAVC’s internal splitter is but if you want to use that out of preference then I don’t see why not.

      As long as you don’t run into any problems either should be fine, the splitter is pretty performance-independent.

  • Carnage

    The next release itself will take some time as the developer is on vacation, so in the meantime, this is the latest version of the LAV Filters pack: http://files.1f0.de/lavf/LAVFilters-video4.zip

    You can consider this build stable. It works with all my 10 bit 4:2:0 and 4:4:4 samples.

    • nand

      Alright, I’ve updated the link to point there – it’s not like I can’t change it, after all.

    • nand

      Alright, it’s already in the main trunk and ETA till it hits stable is approximately 3 weeks until the next build.

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  • Carnage

    Uh, LAV CUVID does not support Hi10P and will not in the foreseeable future. The one which does is LAVVideo. Replace your LAV CUVID one with that.

    • nand

      Thanks for the info. I don’t have an nVidia card myself so I was not sure about how correct this information was.

      Is the LAV Video decoder stable or will it be in any foreseeable timeframe? Afaik they’re all still unofficial alpha releases published by the author, but they haven’t been merged into the main tree yet.

      • Carnage

        LAV Video is pretty much stable now, and ready to be merged with the main trunk. It’s as good as madVR and much better than FFDshow in terms of quality and performance with 10bit content. However, only madVR (either with its internal decoder or LAVVideo) will provide the best quality, since all other renderers make you dither it down.

        • nand

          Alright. Let me know here when the LAV Video decoder enters the main trunk and gets pushed out with the first stable build, and I’ll update the information here + link to it.

  • http://haruhichan.com seidweise

    !@#$ now I feel like my dual dell 24 inch panels are dated as fuck, only 6 bit :o

    • http://www.haruhichan.com nand

      Haha, get a Dell UltraSharp U2410, it’s *amazing* value. 110% NTSC gamut allows you to represent literally any common color space including Adobe RGB with /ease/, full 10 bit processing with programmable 12 LUT tables can have you look down at monitors costing twice as much, and the sRGB mode was calibrated to delta E < 2 by default, which is close enough to not notice any differences using the naked eye.

      Unfortunately, you’ll still need a graphics card that can actually output 10 bit to make the most use of it, so that means either getting a $1000+ FirePro or Quadro card, or getting a cheaper Radeon and using buggy / badly documented / only partially working soft mods.

      Still, for watching anime, it’s simply amazing. (Unless the black borders bother you)

      • http://haruhichan.com seidweise

        Yea, im gonna save up for bigger and badder monitors, my e248wfp’s will hit the end of their life span eventually.

        Thx for the firepro soft mod info/sources, my buddy does alot of cad work and im going to reformat his lappy soon, I want to see if I can get more out of his 4870×2 in autocad.

        • nand

          Definitely can, some of the given speedups are simply insane.

          Find out which driver versions are most stable for 4870×2, and get the latest patch script for that version.

          The guide linked somewhere makes it really easy.

          • http://haruhichan.com seidweise

            I’m going to test this with my own 4870 first this weekend

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  • Petrushka

    guys…i always got the incorrect one at step three. i had uninstalled my CCCP

    is there something wrong with mine?

    • http://www.haruhichan.com nand

      Go to MPC-HC’s setup, under “External Filters”.

      Click on “Add Registered filter”, choose “madVR”, and set it to “Prefer”.

      See if that helps.

    • http://www.haruhichan.com nand

      Added a small Troubleshooting section, see if it helps.

  • Petrushka

    guys, can u help me? i always got an incorrect one in step three….

    back then, i had installed CCCP but i after that, i uninstalled

    what’s wrong with mine?

    • Petrushka

      upssss, wrong email :P

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      Have you installed the latest version of CCCP? It can be found here http://www.cccp-project.net/download.php?type=cccp

      • Petrushka

        well…. for now i have installed the newest CCCP…

        i just wanna try something new :P

  • http://www.haruhichan.com nand

    After getting *actual* 10 bit output to work in my setup (had to patch and install the custom FirePro drivers), I may consider doing a guide on it sooner or later.

    Just wrote a small OpenGL test application to show me a nice 10 bit gradient.

    I can’t go back to 8 bit now, the banding is just too awful :P

  • Skybaby231

    Hey.Nice guid.Might use it.

  • http://www.haruhichan.com nand

    Updated, CCCP now has a stable version.

  • Itsuki

    This is an amazingly helpful guide, thank you very much for it.

  • Anonymous

    I’d just like to mention that madVR can decode Hi10P natively now, and this comes with several advantages:

    1. Much more performance. CCCP Beta’s ffdshow lags severely on some test files, especially ones full of noise – I can get over 500 frame drops in some scenes. madVR’s decoder has 0 drops, even 0 delays.

    2. No 8 bit dithering during the processing stage. CCCP Beta dithers down to 8 bit before passing it to the renderer, and madVR’s internal renderer does not do this.

    I should mention that you’ll need MPC-HC if you want subtitles to work properly, not potplayer.

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      Thanks alot for this input. I will do some research later today and add some more stuff to this. Do you have any links to source at all?

      • nand

        My own research for everything, spent the last few days testing various configurations.

        About the 8 bit dithering thing, madVR’s OSD reports the input bitdepth, and it’s 8 bit when using CCCP beta.

        The reason madVR is so much faster is because it uses a much newer version of libav than either ffdshow or cccp. This is the same reason why mplayer2 is so fast as well.

        I’ve compiled an image guide for easy installation (also available in HTML format), I’ll post the link here:

        <link deleted, see above>

        • nand

          Updated version: <link deleted, see above>

          • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

            Do you mind if I can get the HTML format version and add it to this post? You will get credit. Just reply to this or contact me on Skype – Swaps4 or MSN – swaps4@hotmail.co.uk

    • Velichi

      Seconded on MPC-HC as far as subtitles go. Can’t get Potplayer to display the OP karaoke for Commie’s (8 bit) Deadman Wonderland to display as fast as they do in MPC.

      Potplayer sure displays the chapter breaks all pretty on the seekbar, though…

      • http://www.haruhichan.com nand

        Yep potplayer’s subtitle renderer lags horribly for me as well when I use it. Ask the developer of potplayer, not me.

        Or just wait until madshi implements his subtitle renderer into madVR.

  • Solitude

    thanks for the guide!

  • nij

    Who cares about this new technology for the single pro to it where the cons are more important to consider?

    and what’s up with the comparison screens? all i see is a bitrate depraved encode(for the 10 bit shots)

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      Believe it or not alot of people care. It will be widely supported by mid August (Players, codecs etc). The pros are amazing, same quality, if not better. Also the fact file sizes will be smaller. Comparison screens… not many out at the moment due it’s very new, so the current screen shots wont satisfy everyone yet. I will update this when I get more.

  • http://www.youtube.com/user/BakaDuck BakaDuck

    Nice.

  • Brandyn

    Nice guide.

  • desg

    include sample

    • http://haruhichan.com Swaps4

      Added, if I find anymore I will update this and add them.

  • inf3kted

    Nice